Episode 82- From Corporate Burnout to Confident Consultant: Melissa Lithgow's Pricing and Positioning Lessons
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Melissa Lithgow spent almost 25 years in corporate roles across mining and finance before she built her own consulting practice. It wasn't a clean break. It took three separate health scares, including a 10-day stay in intensive care, before she reassessed what her working life actually needed to look like.
Her story is a common one among consultants, coaches and B2B service providers: high performance built on an unsustainable pace, followed by a slow, sometimes painful process of learning to value your own expertise correctly, especially when it comes to pricing your consulting services.
In this article, drawn from her conversation on The Jane Anderson Show, Episode 82, Melissa shares what actually changed when she stopped underpricing her services, how she built a consulting model designed to make itself unnecessary, and what she'd tell anyone considering the leap from employee to business owner.
If you're navigating any part of that transition, corporate to consulting, employee to expert, or just trying to price your work with more confidence, her experience offers a practical, honest starting point.
Who Is Melissa Lithgow?
Melissa Lithgow is a sales and marketing strategist based in Perth, Australia. She works primarily with medium-to-larger SMEs and C-suite decision-makers, helping them build sales and marketing strategies that hold up over time, not quick wins driven by trends.
Before founding her own practice in 2019, she spent close to 25 years in corporate roles concentrated in mining and finance. Her consulting client list includes brands such as BHP, KPMG and Caterpillar, and her work spans strategy development, coaching, VIP intensive days and team training.
She's also a member of Jane Anderson's Women with Influence community, a program supporting women who run B2B consulting practices.
From 25 Years in Corporate to an ICU Wake-Up Call
Melissa describes her corporate career in mining and finance as genuinely fulfilling: high pressure, high reward, and constantly different.
"No two days were the same, and that's what I absolutely loved about it."
But that pace came at a cost. As she puts it, "the wheel of life" gets a little broken when everything is oriented around performance, and it takes time to notice.
For Melissa, the wake-up call was a 10-day stay in intensive care. At the time, she had three young children, a demanding job, a full travel schedule, and a 5am gym routine on top of it all. Something had to give, and her body made that decision for her.
Workplace burnout of this kind is now formally recognised as an occupational phenomenon by theWorld Health Organization, resulting from chronic, unmanaged workplace stress. Melissa's experience is a personal account, not a clinical case study, but it reflects a pattern many high performers will recognise.
The First Mistake: Becoming an Employee Inside Your Own Client's Business
After the health scare, Melissa tried a full stop, stepping back to be a stay-at-home mum. That lasted about two months before her own mother pointed out she'd shifted into managing the household the same way she'd managed a team at work.
She then tried an online business, which grew into a bricks-and-mortar store. It expanded too quickly, and the same pattern repeated: she took on too much, too fast, and her health suffered again.
By her own account, it took three separate collapses before the lesson stuck. That's when she made the decision to move into consulting, drawing on her varied background in project management, change management and marketing.
Even then, the transition wasn't immediate. In her early consulting work, Melissa found herself effectively becoming an employee inside her clients' businesses, trying to fix everything herself rather than building their internal capability. When she eventually stepped back from those engagements, the improvements she'd made often didn't hold, because the team hadn't been equipped to sustain them without her.
That experience shaped the model she uses today.
The Real Lesson: Pricing Your Value, Not Your Fear
Of everything Melissa discusses, her pricing journey is the most concrete and the most widely applicable, particularly for consultants, coaches and service providers still finding their footing.
How to Stop Underpricing and Overdelivering
Melissa is direct about the mistake she made repeatedly: pricing her services too low, then compensating by overdelivering to justify the fee to herself.
"I was constantly underpricing and just overdelivering hugely, and again, [it] led to me... I got sick again."
The underpricing wasn't a one-time error. It was a pattern that resurfaced every time she moved to a new level in her business or introduced a new service.
"We constantly have these, moving on to the next level or taking on a new service, you're like, 'Oh my gosh, this is new again. I feel like a first grader again. What am I doing?'"
Her advice on breaking the cycle comes down to three things:
Separate your fee from your fear. Pricing based on what you're afraid to ask for, rather than the actual value delivered, sets the pattern of overdelivering to compensate.
Understand the difference between contractor pricing and thought-leader pricing. Melissa makes a clear distinction between being brought in as a day-rate contractor and positioning yourself as an expert others seek out. These require different pricing logic entirely.
Expect the discomfort to resurface. Even with experience, she still finds herself talking herself down from an agreed price after a client call. Recognising that instinct, rather than automatically acting on it, is part of the ongoing work.
This distinction lines up with what's often called value-based pricing in professional services: setting fees according to the outcome a client receives, rather than the hours or effort behind it.
Featured snippet answer:Underpricing typically happens when a consultant prices from self-doubt rather than the value delivered, then compensates by doing more work than the fee covers, a pattern that can lead directly to burnout.
Building an "Exit Model": Consulting Without Creating Dependency
One of the more distinctive parts of Melissa's approach is what she describes as an exit-oriented consulting model.
Rather than staying embedded in a client's business indefinitely, her goal is to leave the client's team more capable than she found them, with the processes, strategy and internal skills to sustain the improvements on their own.
"I just don't feel it's ethical for me to go and take something and implement it and know that it's going to fail the minute I walk out the door."
What an Advisory-Style Engagement Looks Like
In practice, this means Melissa's engagements typically involve:
Assessing what resources a business actually needs (for example, identifying that a team needs a dedicated social media role or a consistent newsletter cadence)
Building the strategy and defining the metrics that matter
Training the internal team so they understand the "why," not just the task list
Stepping back into an advisory role over time, rather than remaining a permanent fixture
She's also selective about who she works with. Her requirement is that clients are genuinely willing to do the work themselves, because an exit-oriented model only functions if the client is prepared to take on what's handed off.
This is a useful model to consider if you're building a consulting or coaching offer and trying to decide between an ongoing retainer structure and a defined, capability-building engagement.
Overcoming Imposter Syndrome as a New Consultant
Melissa spent most of her corporate career at well-known firms: KPMG, BHP and others. She's candid about what that provided: cover.
Hiding Behind a Corporate Brand vs. Owning Your Expertise
"There was safety in that logo, that brand that you worked for. So I could almost hide behind it... it's not me, it's not my expertise. It's KPMG, or it's [BHP]."
When she left to build her own practice, that cover disappeared. She had to put her own name, judgement and track record forward, without a recognisable brand absorbing the risk.
That shift surfaced a familiar pattern: doubting whether her expertise was valuable enough to charge for, even after 25 years of experience.
"It was just overthinking, and thinking, what value really could I give?"
Her way through it wasn't to wait until the self-doubt disappeared. It was to get "comfortable with uncomfortable," treating the discomfort as expected, rather than as a sign she wasn't ready.
What Melissa describes lines up closely with what's commonly known as the imposter phenomenon, the persistent feeling of self-doubt despite clear evidence of competence, which research shows is especially common among high-achieving professionals moving into new or higher-visibility roles.
She also makes a point that's easy to forget: expertise is relative. You don't need to be the most knowledgeable person in your field to genuinely help the person in front of you.
"We forget how much, and we actually don't know how much we do know... there's always someone you can serve at each level."
Featured snippet answer:Imposter syndrome in consulting often stems from losing the borrowed credibility of a corporate brand and having to price and position your own expertise for the first time. It typically resurfaces at every new level or service offering, not just at the start.
Where Grit Comes From: Lessons From an Immigrant Founder Story
Melissa attributes much of her persistence to her upbringing in South Africa, where she says constant change and difficulty were simply normal.
"If you want to achieve, you have to work for it. You're not entitled to anything. It's not a given."
She wasn't able to fund her own tertiary study early on and had to complete it later, after marriage. That experience shaped a mindset she carries into her business today: there is no external safety net coming, so she builds her own, through sustained effort rather than external security.
She's also candid about the tension this creates. Her family are largely government employees, and her decision to build an unpredictable consulting practice sets her apart from that path.
"I'm the black sheep... but I have [what they have] in a different version."
She describes a turning point in how she thought about security. Early in her corporate career, well-known brand names felt like her safety net; they funded her life, her family and her future. Her health crisis reframed that:
"This is so fickle, literally, it's one decision away from all of this being nothing."
That realisation is part of what pushed her to build something of her own, rather than continuing to rely on an employer's stability.
Melissa's Advice for Anyone Starting a Consulting Practice
Asked what she'd tell someone earlier in their consulting journey, Melissa's answer was immediate: don't overthink it.
"Just do it. Think it through, obviously... and then just test it. Put it out there."
She started her own practice at 39, and says she still thinks about the years she spent trying to fit into roles that weren't right for her.
"I only started really late... I just sometimes think about how much I've missed."
Her core message to early-stage consultants is that the downside of trying is smaller than it feels.
"What's the worst that can happen? You go back into corporate, and you've got all these amazing relationships again. There's literally nothing stopping you."
Why Investing in a High-Level Coach Early Matters
Melissa's single strongest recommendation is to invest in high-level coaching earlier than feels necessary.
She admits she initially underestimated how much mindset mattered, assuming that having enough clients would take care of her confidence and pricing on its own. She now sees that belief as flawed; the mindset work has to come first, or alongside the strategy, not after it.
She describes an exercise she now runs with her own clients: picture the most ambitious version of your business and lifestyle, without shrinking the vision to what feels safe. The people who've already built that life, she says, are the people worth learning from directly, because it accelerates progress and helps you avoid costly, avoidable mistakes.
"You're buying time, and you're buying lessons."
Working with a coach, including her own experience with Jane Anderson, was what gave her the clarity to focus her offer, say no to the wrong work, and price with more confidence.
Frequently Asked Questions
How do I know if I'm underpricing my consulting services?
A common sign is consistently overdelivering to feel like you've "earned" your fee, or feeling resentful or exhausted by work that should be sustainable at the agreed price. Melissa Lithgow's own pattern, underpricing followed by burnout, is a useful check: if your workload doesn't match your fee, the price is likely the problem, not your effort.
What does an "exit model" consulting engagement look like?
It's an advisory-style approach where the consultant identifies the resources and strategy a client needs, trains the internal team to execute it, and gradually steps back into a lighter support role, rather than remaining permanently embedded in day-to-day delivery.
How do I transition from a corporate career into consulting?
There's no single formula, but Melissa's experience points to a few consistent factors: reassessing what genuinely motivates you (not just what you're good at), being willing to test an offer publicly rather than perfecting it privately, and expecting the first version of your business to need adjustment.
How do I deal with imposter syndrome when starting a consulting practice?
Recognise that the discomfort of putting your own name and expertise forward, without a known brand behind you, is a normal, expected part of the transition, not a sign you're unprepared. It tends to resurface at every new stage of growth, not just at the beginning.
Conclusion
Melissa Lithgow's path from corporate consultant to independent practice owner wasn't linear, and she doesn't present it that way. It took repeated health warnings, several false starts, and an ongoing, active effort to price her work according to its actual value rather than her own self-doubt.
What stands out most is her honesty about how often the same lessons resurface: pricing discomfort, imposter syndrome, the pull to overdeliver, even after years of experience. For anyone building a consulting or coaching practice, her story is a reminder that these patterns aren't signs of failure. They're part of the work.
Work With Jane Anderson
If pricing your services with confidence, or building a consulting model that doesn't rely on you being indispensable, is something you're working through right now, Women with Influence connects you with the kind of coaching and community Melissa credits with giving her clarity and direction. You can also explore 1:1 Business Coaching with Jane Anderson or a VIP Strategy Day for a more intensive, focused session.
Key Takeaways from Today’s Episode:
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Jane Anderson introduces her podcast, the Jane Anderson Brand New Show, aimed at experts seeking to enhance their impact, influence, and income. The focus is on women in consulting, particularly those working as speakers, trainers, coaches, consultants, and executive coaches within the business-to-business space. Anderson highlights the diverse expertise of her community, which includes leadership, mindset, and cultural transformation experts. She expresses her excitement about sharing insights from her special guest, Melissa Lithgow, a sales and marketing expert who works with small to medium-sized businesses and consulting firms. Lithgow's expertise includes navigating marketing and sales strategies for companies like BHP, KPMG, and Caterpillar. Anderson emphasizes Lithgow's success in transforming her clients' confusion and overwhelm into clarity and excitement.
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Melissa Lithgow recounts her career journey, which mirrors many professional women's experiences. She spent nearly 25 years in the corporate sector, primarily in mining and finance. Lithgow enjoyed the high-pressure, high-reward environment but found it unsustainable, culminating in a 10-day ICU stay. This health scare prompted her to reassess her life priorities, balancing a demanding job with a young family. Lithgow initially tried being a stay-at-home mom and then ventured into a home décor business, both of which were unsatisfactory. Her experiences taught her the importance of sustainable work-life balance. Ultimately, she transitioned to consulting, leveraging her diverse experience in project management, change management, business management, and marketing.
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Lithgow emphasizes that her work always revolved around people, whether in project management or marketing. She discovered the critical role of effective communication and motivation in business success. Transitioning to consulting, she realized that simply having the skills wasn't enough; proper application and alignment with clients' goals were crucial. Lithgow worked with several coaches, including Jane Anderson, who provided clarity and confidence in her business direction. This guidance helped her focus on delivering specific, high-impact services, allowing her to say no to unsuitable projects. The community of like-minded professionals also played a vital role in her growth, providing support and learning opportunities.
Anderson briefly introduces the Women with Influence program, which supports women in consulting. Lithgow explains her focus on serving larger SMEs, helping them achieve better marketing outcomes. Her approach includes empowering clients and their teams to sustain improvements independently. Lithgow insists on working with clients committed to doing the necessary work, ensuring long-term success. Her role often involves advisory work, helping businesses identify the resources and strategies they need. She also provides training to ensure everyone is aligned with the business goals.
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Lithgow highlights the importance of human connection in marketing. She advises businesses to truly understand their customers' needs, which impacts every aspect of their operations. Conversations with business owners often reveal hidden challenges and opportunities, providing valuable insights for strategic planning. Lithgow’s role includes sanity checks and external perspectives that help businesses stay on track. Her focus on asking the right questions and challenging the status quo has proven essential for her clients’ success.
Lithgow shares her insights for those in the early stages of their consulting practice. She emphasizes the importance of taking action rather than overthinking. Starting her consulting journey at 39, she regrets not pursuing her passion earlier. Lithgow encourages others to follow their instincts and embrace the learning opportunities that come with starting a business. The fear of failure should not overshadow the potential growth and experiences gained.
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Mel reflects on the security she felt working in the corporate world, particularly in big firms like KPMG, FMG, and BHP. She admits that the well-established brand names allowed her to "hide" behind their reputations, feeling less pressure to prove her own expertise. The transition to entrepreneurship, where she had to market her own skills and knowledge, was challenging. She discusses the common fear of undervaluing oneself and the importance of acknowledging one's own expertise. This process involved overcoming the imposter syndrome and understanding the unique value she could offer at different levels of service.
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Mel shares her journey of becoming comfortable with discomfort, a necessary part of growth and improvement. She highlights the struggles with pricing her services appropriately, initially underpricing and overdelivering, which led to burnout and health issues. She emphasizes the need for continuous learning and upskilling, comparing it to building a ship while sailing. Mel also discusses the importance of having supportive conversations and positioning herself confidently as a strategic marketing expert.
Jane commends Mel for her resilience and determination, noting how she persistently moves forward despite challenges. Mel attributes her grit to her upbringing in South Africa, where constant change and difficulties were the norm. She explains that without a safety net, she had to create her own by working hard. Mel's drive to achieve a better life than what she was exposed to growing up fuels her perseverance. She acknowledges the lack of a safety net, which pushed her to work tirelessly to create her own security.
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Mel discusses the significant mindset shift required to transition from being an employee to a business owner. She talks about the reliance on corporate brands for security and the realization that true safety lies in her own efforts and abilities. This shift in perspective opened up a world of possibilities and opportunities. Mel appreciates the balance of emotional connection and analytical thinking provided by her mentor, Jane, which helps her navigate the business world confidently.
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The conversation moves towards the courage required to create one's own safety net and the deep sense of purpose driving Mel's work. She reflects on the significant amount of courage it takes to step away from the security of a traditional job and pursue her own path. Mel highlights the importance of having a clear purpose, which fuels her determination and helps her tackle tough challenges. This sense of purpose is what gets her out of bed every morning and drives her to do the best work possible, despite the difficulties she faces.
Mel emphasizes the significance of investing in a high-level coach early in one’s entrepreneurial journey. She admits that initially, she underestimated the importance of mindset, believing that business success alone would manage it. However, she soon realized that a positive and growth-oriented mindset is crucial for taking significant steps forward. Mel advises aspiring entrepreneurs to dream big and surround themselves with people who have already achieved their goals. By doing so, they can learn from these mentors and accelerate their own progress, avoiding costly mistakes and reaching their goals more efficiently.
Mel discusses the exercise she uses with her clients to envision their most extraordinary and ambitious lifestyle. She stresses the importance of dreaming big and seeking mentorship from those who have already succeeded in that realm. Investing in high-level coaching helps entrepreneurs gain valuable insights and avoid unnecessary mistakes, enabling them to achieve their goals faster. Jane reinforces this by sharing her belief in the power of mentorship and the importance of learning from experts who have already paved the way.
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For those interested in following Mel's journey or learning more about her work, she provides her contact information. Mel can be reached through her website (melissalithgow.com.au), LinkedIn (melissalithgow), and Instagram (melissalithgow). Jane thanks Mel for joining the conversation, expressing admiration for her resilience and dedication. Mel reciprocates by acknowledging the immense value Jane provides to her community, highlighting the importance of implementation in their mentor-mentee relationship.
The conversation wraps up with mutual appreciation and a positive outlook on the future. Mel and Jane reflect on the fun and productive nature of their relationship, underscoring the importance of trust and belief in one another. Jane encourages listeners to reach out to Mel, explore her resources, and follow her work. The discussion ends on a supportive note, wishing Mel continued success in her business endeavors.
Full Show Transcript:
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Hi there, my name's Jane Anderson and this is the Jane Anderson Brand New Show. It's the podcast for experts who want to have greater impact, influence and income for their businesses and careers. As experts, we know that people buy from people and work with people who they know, who they like and who they trust.
So I'm so glad you're here because it's that time again now to really amplify how you show up in the world. Hi there and welcome to the Jane Anderson Show. I am so thrilled that you are here.
We are talking all things women in consulting, so women with influence, and that's working with women who are speakers, trainers, coaches, consultants, executive coaches, thought leaders, but particularly working in the business to business space. So a lot of the people that are in our community are leadership experts, mindset experts, cultural transformation, you name it, whatever those capabilities are for working with organisations. This is probably where you'll find us.
So I typically work with women all over Australia and I'm thrilled to be able to share with you one of our very special guests today and someone who's in our women with influence community. She is a sales and marketing expert and she specifically works with business owners, quite a lot of consulting firms, and that small to sort of medium business type space and really helping them to navigate through the overwhelm and fear sometimes and confusion that can come with being able to get both marketing and sales right and getting those two to come together. She's worked with brands like BHP, KPMG, Caterpillar, and really helping them to be able to work out what their sales and marketing strategies are, being able to get their team working well if it's a marketing and sales team, and particularly working in the internal and external comms.
She does lots of coaching, strategy development, VIP days, training, all those sorts of things, and her clients really shift from being a bit lost and confused and overwhelmed to really feeling excited and feeling like I've got a plan and a pathway ahead. So our very special guest today is Melissa Lithgow. Yay!
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Hi Mel, thank you so much for joining us on the podcast today. I'm so thrilled you're here. I know you are super busy, so thanks for being part of the podcast.
Hey Jane, it's a pleasure and thanks for having me. Mel, you have such an interesting background and what's led you to having your consulting practice today. Are you happy to share a little bit about your journey and how you got to a point of having melissalithgow.com.au?
[Speaker 1] (2:54 - 5:17)
Yeah, I think it's quite similar to a lot of professional women out there. So I was obviously in corporate for almost 25 years. I was concentrated in mining and finance industries predominantly.
Loved what I did. High sort of pressure, high reward, always on the go, always learning things. So no two days were the same and that's what I absolutely loved about it.
But with that is also the wheel of life is a little bit broken and it takes you a little while to get to that stage of actually realizing that something's got to give. So for me that happened when I ended up in ICU for 10 days. Obviously something was wrong and I had to do a bit of soul searching and reassess what it was that I wanted out of life.
I have three boys and they were quite young at that stage still. So I had it all. I had a young family, I had a great job, I traveled, I had a great paycheck at the end of the month.
I even got up at 5am every day to go to the gym. But somehow it wasn't sustainable and my body told me that. And I sort of had to reassess and I think when you're in that stage you sort of go from extreme to extreme.
So I went the other way going, okay, I'll just be a stay at home mum. And that lasted about two months and my mum said, can you stop managing us? Oh right.
When did you get back to work? Dad. Exactly.
They were ready. And okay, well I'll start a little online hiding boutique because that'll sort of lean into keeping me busy and it's something I enjoy and learning a new technology, seeing where the marketing would take me. And that sort of grew into bricks and mortar store again, went completely the wrong way in taking on too much, too quickly.
And again, fell into the illness trap where my body said no more. I don't know how many times I have to learn this lesson, but apparently three is a charm for me. I really stepped back then and said, okay, let me reassess what I need to do.
What is it that actually lights me up about everything? And I literally just made pros and cons lists and things that I wanted in my life and things that I didn't and feelings I wanted and situations I wanted or didn't want. And I decided to go the consulting route.
So my experience is quite varied in terms of project management, change management, general business management, and then of course marketing, but everything was always related to people.
[Speaker 2] (5:18 - 5:18)
Right.
[Speaker 1] (5:18 - 6:15)
And that's why I enjoyed the most out of each of those things. And people were always the key to doing a good job in each of those areas because systems are great, but if people are not on board, it's not going to work. If people aren't motivated or just have the right messaging or just know what they're working towards, everyone's trying to do the right thing, but what is that thing?
So trying to get them to pull into the same direction was usually key in getting projects off the ground or even just successfully completing them. The change management aspect was just getting them to know why they're doing things. No one wants to just go to work and be told what to do five, eight hours a day and go home.
They want an impact. They want to be part of something. Yes.
So it's telling that story and then getting what's in it for them, basically. So I decided to go the consulting route for marketing. And because of my knowledge in the other areas, I did get lost in delivering multiple things for multiple people.
[Speaker 2] (6:15 - 6:15)
Right.
[Speaker 1] (6:15 - 7:43)
And I then became an employee for people in their business where you try and fix it all. And just because you can do something doesn't mean you should. And again, my time was just being, I was burning myself out for poor people and they weren't really learning to actually have me exit the company.
So the minute I exit, then it fell apart again. So again, I did it. It's constantly reassessing.
It's never stopped. So I just reassessed again and said, okay, what is it that I need? So I worked with a couple of coaches who were great for the stage that I needed them at.
And I was stalking you for probably about four years before I actually had my discovery call with you. And the minute we had that call, there was just instant clarity for me in terms of what I was doing, how I was going to do it. And then it was just doing the hard work and rolling it out.
The weight was lifted. Everything grew from there. My confidence grew because my messaging was on point.
I knew exactly what I was delivering. I was so much more focused. And I could actually, I was also empowered enough to say no to things that I shouldn't be doing.
So, yeah, it was just phenomenal. And then, of course, just being exposed to the people in the community and the types of people you have in there, I just sit there most days in awe. And it's just it's such a great learning curve for me.
And I'm just grateful for it. So, yeah, that's been my journey up to now. So now the focus is around actually.
[Speaker 2] (7:43 - 8:21)
So can I just quickly jump in? So for those who are listening and going, what's this thing that she's talking about, this community and the ladies. So a quick little plug is we have a program called Women with Influence, which Mel is a member of.
We've been running the program since 2017. And so now we particularly focus on women who have consulting practices and who are selling B2B. So that leads us now to the type of practice that you have.
So tell us now that you've got the clarity on your message, you've got a lot more confidence in what you're saying around with your positioning and your offers and things like that. So who do you work with mostly now?
[Speaker 1] (8:21 - 9:07)
So I mostly service SMEs, but on the larger side of SME, it's usually people who want to see more return out of their marketing efforts. They're not scared to try new things and they're not scared to get their hands dirty too. My focus is to empower them and their teams to achieve.
And my focus is eventually to exit the business and have a running team and processes and systems and strategy that they can work towards. And then, of course, you go in when it's needed and when readjustment is needed and support. But I just don't feel it's ethical for me to go and take something and implement it and know that it's going to fail the minute I walk out the door, which is why I have a very clear line requirement of people actually wanting to do the work who work with me.
[Speaker 2] (9:07 - 9:51)
Right. So you come in, it's kind of like advisory type capacity, here's the resources you need based on the goals that you're trying to achieve. You need three people or you need someone to do social media, need someone or you need to be having a newsletter go out.
So you'll do the strategy and sort of look at what are the metrics you're chasing? Here's the marketing strategy that here are the resources you need. I can come in and train them, make sure everyone's on the same page.
And then over time, they become more empowered to be able to build that capacity themselves. You're sort of guiding the ship along the way. And then so you also do coaching and you speak at events and things as well.
[Speaker 1] (9:51 - 10:52)
Yeah, it's all about the human connection. So it's for me, it's, again, changing the way that businesses think about their marketing and focusing on their customers and actually really knowing what their customers want and what it is that they need because it affects everything in their business. And sometimes it's even just having a conversation with these business owners and saying, what is it that you want?
You know, that conversation we had when you're in the bottle, you can't read the label. And we get it because we have it every day. You become blind to your own business.
And that is the biggest, the biggest, the biggest benefit I see from even just working, you know, like I said, with the community. It's just someone outside of your business who has your interests at heart and that can just be a bit of a sanity check for you. Yeah.
So that's exactly what I am for them. And then the tools are just tools. It's just having those conversations and asking those questions and getting them to actually think about what they want.
And it's occurring that way because we've always done something this way doesn't mean we always should. And because you've had your, you started your practice, what year was this that you started?
[Speaker 2] (10:53 - 11:17)
2019. And so you're still in those early growth stages of your practice. There's a lot of people who perhaps be listening, either thinking about making that jump into their own practice or perhaps in their first or second year.
We talk to lots of people who are particularly in that first and second year. What have been the biggest lessons you've learnt so far in growing your practice?
[Speaker 1] (11:17 - 12:19)
It's the overthinking for me. Yeah. Just do it.
Think it through, obviously. Think it through. You've got that great system to get us really clear on what we need to do and why we want to do it.
And then just test it. Put it out there. Go for it and test it.
I only started really late. So my whole journey only started at 39. So I just sometimes think about how much I've missed and all the opportunities I've missed because I was always trying to push myself into a square peg in a round hole.
If you've got that in you and you've got that feeling of there's something more in me or I feel like there's something more, I should be doing something more. Do it. There's nothing to fear about it, because number one, you learn so much.
So although even if you do, you know, what's the worst that can happen? You go back into corporate and you've got all these and all these amazing relationships again. So it's literally nothing stopping you.
It's the overthinking and fear of judgment and fear of failure. And honestly, it's the last thing we should be scared of.
[Speaker 2] (12:19 - 12:20)
Right.
[Speaker 1] (12:20 - 12:25)
I would rather do it than have the regrets of I should have done this. And trust me, you do have those.
[Speaker 2] (12:26 - 12:35)
And what sort of things were you overthinking, Mel? Was it type of clients? Was it programs?
Was it what was some of the things that you found you were overthinking?
[Speaker 1] (12:36 - 13:35)
I think it was more in terms of just getting out of because I've always worked corporate and very much the big four. Usually there was safety in that logo, that brand that you worked for. So I could almost hide behind it because the brand had the runs on the board.
It's not me. It's not my expertise. It's KPMG or it's FMG or it's BHP.
The fear of putting yourself out there and what you know and what you think. And again, because we forget how much and we actually don't know how much we do know, we forget that not everyone's at that level. And obviously there's a bucketload of people who will know more, but there's always someone you can serve at each level.
And it's getting them to that next one the quickest. And it's same with your coaching. Like I said, I've had a couple of coaches and they were great for the level that I was on.
But you need to keep going, keep upskilling, keep improving. And it was just overthinking and thinking, what value really could I give? And then just getting comfortable with it.
[Speaker 2] (13:35 - 13:38)
So sometimes a bit of the imposter, it sounds like, Mel.
[Speaker 1] (13:38 - 13:38)
Absolutely.
[Speaker 2] (13:39 - 13:47)
Am I actually any good at this? Am I as good as what I'm saying? I don't know.
I'm sort of giving myself a big rap here. But yeah, absolutely.
[Speaker 1] (13:48 - 14:03)
And then it's also with what's my performance appraisal going to say? You know, it's like your your way of valuing yourself and your contribution. It has to change.
And you have to just become comfortable with uncomfortable. That's so true. You are building the ship as you sail.
[Speaker 2] (14:04 - 14:09)
And it's what's safe in the plane while jumping off the cliff. I like that.
[Speaker 1] (14:09 - 15:20)
That's it. Yeah. And sometimes I feel like I'm back to a little raft, but it's OK.
Because we'll just build the ship again. And this time I've got ten different people on my little raft with me building together. So and being OK with having those conversations that I can actually now say that I'm a strategic marketing expert and own it because I am.
And it's OK. And it doesn't mean that I'm full of myself. Or I have to position myself so people can trust me and that I have to give them the value that they need.
And it's the same with pricing. I had a huge issue with pricing according to the value that I gave. Yeah, I was constantly underpricing and just overdelivering hugely.
Again, led to me not. I got sick again. So then I don't have any value to anyone, especially not my family.
So, yeah, it's not just me. These are probably the biggest things I hear constantly from women who do this and women who are not even just starting out. We constantly have these moving on to the next level or taking on a new service.
You're like, oh, my gosh, this is new again. I feel like a first grader again. What am I doing?
[Speaker 2] (15:21 - 18:32)
I love that, Mel. I admire you so much because you are one of the toughest people I know in terms of your mindset and resilience and grit and how you just bloody keep on going. You put one foot in front of the other and it just always I'm always in awe of you that you just show up and you go, right, I'm bloody doing this.
And you just do it despite you do it. You might be out of your comfort zone and you just go and that you trust me. You go, all right, well, Jane's telling me to do it.
Yeah, I do what Jane says. So I always really admire that about you. And you've been through a lot with your health.
You move countries like it's a very big thing to move countries. You've got so much resilience and strength. And because it's hard, like this sort of work, it all looks lovely.
It all looks like, oh, imagine being able to just get up when you want to get up. Imagine being able to just work in your pajamas and do whatever you want. But with this freedom comes responsibility.
But the grit and determination that it takes. I read a quote yesterday that I really loved. It said, you don't have discipline without purpose.
And you are so purpose driven, which is what keeps you sort of showing up all the time. So I really admire that about you. You talked about being comfortable with discomfort and because you're doing a lot of things sometimes you've never done before.
And pricing is a big one, because for us as women, we often undervalue. And that's been a recurring theme that you've had. And the lesson that sometimes you've either learnt or continue to learn grow is that actually I've got to manage how much I'm giving for what I'm charging.
So I've got to work out and value myself, value my the efforts that I bring, identify what is the value for the client and the outcome and make sure I've got all that balance right. That's a big learning, I think, for a lot of women who go into this consulting space and go, you know, because otherwise you're flying blind because you come out of corporate and they go, oh, well, they get consultants in and they charge a thousand dollars a day. We go, when you're a thought leader and you're positioning yourself as an expert in your field where we're not consulting as in we're going in and doing a 12 month contract as an employee, like you said, is that actually, no, this is a different type of positioning.
This is thought leader positioning where you're going, well, I'm actually one of the best in the world at what I do. I'm not necessarily. So there's a real accelerator clutch to go, well, hang on, I've still got to manage cash flow and I've got to be able to make sure, excuse me, got cash flow and things coming in.
Plus, I'm over here trying to get my programs up and trying to do the thought leadership. And I mean, you came to our content creation bootcamp and smashed out a year's worth of content leadership in three days. That takes a lot of grit and thinking to do that.
So I guess what my question is, how do you have the level of grit that you have? I think it's dumb luck, Jo.
[Speaker 1] (18:33 - 18:59)
What? I just think it's dumb. I've never even thought of it that way, to be honest.
You just have to do what you have to do. We're immigrants. Obviously, I'm South African.
Our way of growing up was very different. So there was, again, constant change, constant difficulties. But you didn't see it as difficulties.
It was just getting through the day. You just do these things and that's what you got to do. And it's just that if you want to achieve, you have to work for it.
[Speaker 2] (19:00 - 19:00)
Right.
[Speaker 1] (19:00 - 20:02)
You're not entitled to anything. It's not a given. The government's not going to look after me.
If I want a certain life, I'm going to have to work for it. And also, I think I couldn't study. Mum was divorced and she couldn't afford studying.
So you have to do it yourself. So you do that and you get your study in after, you know, once you got married. And it's just not easy.
And I think because it never was just easy for me, that's my norm. Yes. Just put one foot in front of the other and just keep going.
And it does pay off. And then some days I have to be reminded because I do the same thing over and over. And I'm just like, thanks, Jane, especially when it comes to like the pricing.
And we have a call and I will decide on the price and then I go sit down and I do my workings around it and I go back to the initial price. I don't know, Jane, I don't know. It's a difficult question for me to answer because I don't see it as anything different.
I think everyone has issues and everyone has difficulties and we all just show up in a way we can. I think the thing for me is I never had a safety net.
[Speaker 2] (20:03 - 20:03)
Right.
[Speaker 1] (20:03 - 20:07)
So if I wanted a safety net, I had to be that safety net.
[Speaker 2] (20:07 - 20:07)
Right.
[Speaker 1] (20:07 - 20:09)
And my safety net was to work my butt off.
[Speaker 2] (20:10 - 20:10)
Yeah.
[Speaker 1] (20:10 - 20:14)
And I wanted more. Yeah. I'm not ashamed to say that.
[Speaker 2] (20:14 - 20:15)
Yes.
[Speaker 1] (20:15 - 20:24)
I wanted more than what I was when I was exposed to. Yes. And that's OK.
I'm actually OK with saying that people may see me differently for that, but it's all right.
[Speaker 2] (20:24 - 20:50)
I'm OK with that. Well, it's a big reason why to get the right people around you, isn't it? Is that the people who understand why you're doing that?
Because I know my family, I love my family. I adore them, but they're all government workers. So, yeah, I'm the black sheep.
So why would you do this to yourself? Don't you want holidays? Don't you want leave?
Do you want to get those things? But I have them in a different version of how you have them.
[Speaker 1] (20:51 - 21:00)
It's just a different drive that we have inside us. And I had all that. Right.
And it's funny because I actually flipped when I started working. The safety net was those brands.
[Speaker 2] (21:00 - 21:00)
Right.
[Speaker 1] (21:01 - 21:21)
Right. So that's how I could study. That's how I could pay my rent.
That's how I could look after my family. That's how I would retire with actually money in the bank. But when I got so sick, I was like, that's the realization going.
This is so fickle. Literally, it's one one decision away from all of this being nothing.
[Speaker 2] (21:21 - 21:22)
Yes.
[Speaker 1] (21:22 - 21:36)
And the more you sort of open yourself up to that little voice that says there has to be more, the more it blossoms. And there's suddenly there is so much more. And it's just your world opens up.
And it's lovely. It's an amazing thing. I wish just I wish I had it earlier.
[Speaker 2] (21:36 - 21:48)
Oh, well, at least you haven't started your practice doing it for 10 years, making all the mistakes I made. Oh, so that's how you do it. Oh, OK.
But I call you early.
[Speaker 1] (21:49 - 22:41)
Because you see, I don't feel like we did. Yeah. Those mistakes are now serving us.
Right. Because you see us make it's like watching a child in a playground. You know what's going to happen.
So you catch us. And we're so grateful for that. And for me, because I'm a bit of a mix, because I'm all about people and connecting and feeling.
But also I need to see the numbers and I need to see the why. And I have to anchor into something substantial. And I think that's my fear is still sort of there going.
You have to still prove it to me. And you give me both in everything you do. I actually see I get the feeling, I get the why in terms of in my heart.
But I also get the OK on paper. Is this a good thing or not? So it's just a shift in perspective.
And you also have to make it a mindset shift from being an employee to being a business owner. Yes, because the focus areas are so much different.
[Speaker 2] (22:41 - 24:24)
I love that you are creating your own safety net. Like you say, we're not relying on. It takes an incredible amount of courage to do this and to be so on purpose.
This is what you want to do. And this is the safety net. This is the future that you're trying to create for yourself.
And this is your life's work. This is why you've been put on the planet. This is not just going, oh, yeah, I want freedom and I want to be able to do my own thing and I don't want to report to a boss anymore.
There's a deep sense of purpose and grit that gets you up out of bed every morning that makes you go. You have to do some of the toughest work that you'll have ever done. The only way you can do it, because for you to be able to persist with pricing and working through all those challenges that we all have is that you can only do that if you really see this work as why you've been put on the planet and to do your your best work.
This is why you've been put here. So I think you're a real inspiration for not just business owners and the clients you work with, but I think particularly for women in business and for particularly people who Australia is full of a lot of immigrants. A lot of people moved here from somewhere.
So I think that your ability to not only make the changes that you have, but to lead yourself and to create what you're trying to create is really inspirational, Mel. So for those who might be you've given some tips already around not overthinking things. And so for if there was anyone listening who's thinking, OK, I they're inspired by your story.
-
Is there any other advice or tips you might have for them if they're thinking about going down this path of or they're trying to work out how to grow and scale like you are?
[Speaker 1] (24:25 - 24:31)
I think for me, I would invest in a high level coach much earlier. That's the right answer.
[Speaker 2] (24:32 - 24:36)
I haven't paid her to say that, by the way. I'm sorry, Mel.
[Speaker 1] (24:36 - 25:44)
Oh, maybe later. No, because mindset has such a big impact. And I was it's like saying my kids are never going to be that naughty.
And my kids will never have an iPad. I had to eat my because I was always like, oh, mindset. Come on, business is going to if you give me enough business, my mindset takes care of itself.
And it's the thing is a lot of nonsense. Like, yeah, your mindset has to be right in order for you to take all these steps. And having a high level coach or coach where you want to be and dream big, don't hold yourself, keep yourself small.
Literally, I have an exercise that I do with my clients, and it's the most out there, most fiercely amazing lifestyle you can imagine. What does that look like? And then they say, oh, I drive a Toyota and I live in Lola.
I'm like, no, what is that's not imagine the biggest thing. And then who's playing in that area? And that's who you want to be around, because those are the people that have done it.
It is more. Yes. And I understand it because obviously finances was it feeds into it.
But you're buying time and you're buying lessons and you just excel so much quicker when you're surrounded by the right people.
[Speaker 2] (25:44 - 25:45)
Yeah.
[Speaker 1] (25:45 - 25:57)
And you don't make costly mistakes. So, yeah, just do it quicker. Go as big as you want to dream and just do it.
Yeah, because you're going to have those feelings. Even if you're playing with a smaller coach, it takes longer.
[Speaker 2] (25:57 - 26:53)
And you regret that you didn't go the path that's already been worn. Why not go and tap into the expertise as I have? That's what I believe in is all the experts and people that have coached me.
So it's not necessarily that I'm the guru. And I've sure I've learnt lots of lessons and done things the hard way. So ways to do some things.
And but you're right, is the culmination of implementation, mentors, experience, all those things. And that goes for yourself as your clients, being able to bring that value to them so that they can get that outcome too. So, Mel, for those who want to perhaps follow you or to connect with you, if they want to find out more about your journey or to be able to learn about the work that you're doing in terms of your connected marketing and using you as you as a strategic marketer, where would you like people to follow you or reach out to you?
[Speaker 1] (26:53 - 27:04)
So the website is melissalithgow.com.au LinkedIn is melissalithgow.com and then Instagram also melissalithgow.com. All right, great.
[Speaker 2] (27:04 - 27:17)
We'll pop the links in the show notes. Thank you so much for joining us today. We're cheering you on and look forward to seeing you continue to scale.
You're doing an awesome job.
[Speaker 1] (27:17 - 27:25)
Thank you. And I just thank you to you and everything that you do for your community. It's honestly, you just don't know the value that you add and the difference you make for people.
[Speaker 2] (27:26 - 27:56)
You're super kind. Thank you so much. You're easy to mentor.
It's all that. I had a mentor once who said to me, the greatest compliment you could ever give your coach or your mentor is to implement what they ask you to do. And I've always believed that was, you know, and that's why I got so much extra help from them and all of that because of implementation.
And I think there's no doubt about you with what you do is that you just go, yep, OK, implement done. What's next? So you know, it works.
[Speaker 1] (27:56 - 28:03)
Yeah. So because it works and we believe in you, we have the trust in you. So, yeah, it's a good relationship both ways.
[Speaker 2] (28:04 - 28:21)
It's good. And we have a lot of fun. Oh, so much.
Thanks, Mel. Great to have you on the show. I'll pop the show notes in.
Make sure you reach out to Mel, at least follow what she's doing. She's got some cool stuff on her website and white papers and different things. Yeah.
Wishing you every success in the growth in your practice, Mel. Thanks, Jane.
Most of the guests interviewed are current or alumni members of the Women With Influence community. Click here to find out more
