Episode 73- How to Leverage Your Expertise to Build a Consulting Practice: Lessons from Kim Seeling Smith
Podcast is also available on the versions below:
Get Notified Of Future Episodes on Apple Podcasts | Spotify
If you've ever felt like your past career is irrelevant to the consulting business you actually want to build, you're not alone. It's one of the most common traps for experts starting out on their own: assuming that because you're moving in a new direction, you have to leave everything you already know behind.
Kim Seeling Smith didn't. She built one of the more unusual and resilient consulting careers around: from an accidental accountant, to a 15-year recruitment consultant, to a globally recognised Future of Work expert who has sat at the table with Sir Richard Branson. And she did it by refusing to throw away what she already knew.
Kim is the CEO of Ignite Global, author of Mind Reading for Managers, and a member of the global steering committee for Virgin Unite's 100% Human at Work initiative. She spoke with Jane Anderson on the full episode of The Jane Anderson Show about the real, unglamorous mechanics of building a consulting practice: how to repackage your expertise instead of discarding it, how to design a business model that actually fits your strengths, and how to deal with the imposter syndrome that shows up right when things start working.
This article breaks down what she shared, and how you can apply the same thinking to your own practice.
Who Is Kim Seeling Smith?
Kim Seeling Smith is a Future of Work expert who helps organisations build and retain a workforce fit for a post-pandemic world. As CEO of Ignite Global, she consults internationally on employee retention, engagement, and organisational culture.
Her career has taken her from the United States to New Zealand to Australia, and her work has been featured on Sunrise, The Today Show, Forbes, Fast Company, SmartCompany, CNBC, and the Australian Financial Review. She wrote Mind Reading for Managers, co-authored a career development guide with Brian Tracy, and was named a Top 101 Global Influencer on Employee Engagement.
She is also one of just 15 people on the global steering committee for Virgin Unite's 100% Human at Work initiative, a role that has put her in the same room as Sir Richard Branson, and by her own account, George and Amal Clooney.
None of that came from a straight line. It came from a career that, in her own words, took "several twists and turns," and from a decision, at a critical point, to leverage what she already knew rather than start from zero.
From Recovering Accountant to Recruiter: An Unlikely Career Path
Kim describes herself as a "recovering accountant." At 19, she took well-meaning career advice that pushed her away from the hotel industry (a job she loved) and into accounting, a field that turned out to be a poor fit for her natural strengths.
She spent five years at KPMG "failing miserably," by her own description, before recognising that the common denominator in her professional struggles wasn't the job. It was her.
That recognition led her, somewhat by accident, into recruitment, a career she found immediately fulfilling. She gave herself 90 days to test it out. Within 30, she knew she'd found her niche.
The GFC Gift: Reverse-Engineering 5,000 Exit Interviews
After 15 years and roughly 5,000 candidate interviews across the US, New Zealand, and Australia, Kim decided to shift from recruitment into consulting, helping organisations keep their best people rather than simply placing them.
The timing wasn't planned, but it was fortunate. She moved to Australia just as the Global Financial Crisis hit, and demand for recruitment all but disappeared. Rather than treat that as a setback, she used the unexpected downtime to reverse-engineer everything she'd learned from those 5,000 exit interviews.
The result was her first model: the Nine Currencies of Choice.
Why You Should Leverage Your Expertise, Not Discard It
This is the single most important lesson in Kim's story, and she's explicit about it: "Leverage your experience. Do not negate your experience."
It's tempting, when starting a consulting practice, to see your previous career as something separate, even something to hide. Kim pushed back on that instinct directly, describing it as human nature to want to "throw the baby out with the bathwater" when a past role feels frustrating or limiting.
Instead of abandoning her recruitment background when she moved into consulting, she repackaged its engagement methodology that clients could buy into as something new.
The same knowledge that had made her a strong recruiter, a deep, practical understanding of why people join organisations and why they leave, became the foundation of a retention and solely related to a mistake many consultants make around pricing and undervaluing their own expertise, treating hard-won experience as a liability to move past, rather than an asset to charge for.
The Nine Currencies of Choice Model
The Nine Currencies of Choice is the model Kim built from those 5,000 interviews. She has used it to help organisations dramatically improve employee engagement and retention, including one IT department at a heavy equipment manufacturer that went from the lowest employee engagement scores in the business to the highest, beating the next-highest department by 23 points. Employee engagement research consistently links this kind of engagement lift to lower turnover and stronger business performance, which is part of why models like this one have staying power with clients.
The model has only been formally updated twice, most notably after Kim conducted additional research during the "Great Resignation," reflecting how the underlying drivers of retention shift as the labour market changes.
The lesson for anyone building a consulting practice isn't the specific framework, it's the process. Kim didn't invent a retention model from nothing. She built it entirely from expertise she already had, just applied to a new problem.
Designing a Consulting Business Model Around Your Strengths
Many consultants assume they need to do everything: speak at conferences, run training programs, offer one-on-one coaching, write books, and build online courses, all at once. Kim's business evolved differently, and more deliberately.
She started out wanting to be a conference speaker. Client demand pulled her into training instead: organisations wanted more than a conversation-starter; they wanted a program that created lasting change. That's what led to Mind Reading for Managers, built around the Nine Currencies of Choice.
Over time, her mix shifted again. Today, her practice runs at roughly 40% training, 40% consulting, and 20% speaking, a balance she's continued to adjust as her focus has moved toward more strategic, C-suite-level work on the future of work.
Speaking, Training, Consulting, Licensing: Finding Your Mix
Kim is candid about why this matters: a solo consultant can't excel at every mode of delivery. As she puts it, there's "only one of you." Trying to be a speaker, author, trainer, facilitator, coach, and mentor simultaneously isn't sustainable.
Her advice is to identify where your actual strengths sit (for her, that's research and intellectual property creation) and build the delivery model around that, rather than trying to personally deliver every service your business offers.
The Affiliate Model: Letting Others Deliver Your IP
One of the more distinctive parts of Kim's business is her affiliate model. She's developed a train-the-trainer version of Mind Reading for Managers, available in a fully digital, on-demand format. Affiliates in both the US and Australia now deliver that program on her behalf, while she stays focused on research and developing new intellectual property.
The arrangement works both ways: affiliates get a proven, tangible program they can sell, plus the ability to upsell additional coaching and workshops to the clients it brings them. Kim gets to stay in the part of the business she's best at, without being the bottleneck for every client engagement.
This isn't the only valid model: Kim notes that some consultants prefer to curate other people's IP rather than create their own, and that's a legitimate strategy too. The point isn't which model is correct. It's that the model should fit how you actually want to work.
The iROC File: A Simple Tool to Beat Imposter Syndrome
Even with a strong track record (a published book, a proven model, a seat at the table with Richard Branson), Kim says imposter syndrome hasn't disappeared. It shows up "at every level," and she's spent close to a year working with a mindset coach specifically to address it.
Imposter syndrome isn't just a personal quirk: it's a well-documented psychological pattern that affects high achievers across industries, disproportionately including women and other groups who've had to prove themselves repeatedly.
One of the tools Kim credits most for managing it is something she calls the iROC file.
How to Create Your Own iROC File
The idea is simple: keep a physical file of evidence documenting your impact. Performance reviews, thank-you notes from clients, results you've delivered: anything that proves, in writing, that you've made a difference.
Kim discovered the effect almost by accident. While cleaning out old files during a move between New Zealand and Australia, she came across a handwritten note from a CEO who had once been impressed enough by her work to write it down. Rereading it, and other things she'd saved over the years, she noticed how much more confident and capable she immediately felt.
That became the iROC file, a name inspired by the American phrase "you rock." When anxiety or self-doubt creeps in before a difficult client meeting or a new project, she pulls out the physical folder and reads through it. The point of keeping it physical, rather than digital, is that flipping through tangible evidence has a stronger effect than scrolling past the same information on a screen.
It's a small, low-cost habit, but it's a concrete way to counter the kind of self-doubt that can otherwise stall growth in a consulting practice, particularly for people who are used to constantly moving on to the next challenge without pausing to register what they've already achieved.
When (and How) to Build Your Support System
Kim is direct about the biggest challenge she's faced in growing her own practice: building a proper support system around herself, especially after letting her assistant go in the early days of COVID-19 and simply never replacing her.
She describes the toll of trying to do everything alone as leading to a significant bout of burnout roughly nine months before this conversation. Her honest reflection: despite teaching clients about strengths, weaknesses, and time management, she hadn't been following her own advice.
From Virtual Assistant to Operations Manager
Kim identifies two distinct points where consultants typically need to bring in support, and they require different kinds of help.
The first tends to arrive earlier, often around a revenue plateau. At this stage, the real issue usually isn't strategy: it's that the consultant is undervaluing their own time and expertise, and hasn't yet delegated basic operational work like calendar management and email.
The second point comes later, during a phase of more extreme growth, when a consultant has already built recognition, media coverage, and a track record. At this stage, the support needed shifts from purely operational to more strategic: someone who can help create the space to think, rather than simply clearing admin tasks.
Kim has moved through both stages. She now works with a part-time operations manager and has recently brought a virtual assistant on board, describing the shift as one from "operational support" to something closer to strategic partnership.
She's candid that this transition takes courage. Investing in support means real financial outlay before you necessarily see a return, and for many consultants, Kim specifically names imposter syndrome among women as a factor here, there's real hesitation about whether they've earned the right to that kind of help.
If you're trying to work out where your own practice sits on that journey, structured planning helps. This is exactly the kind of strategic-level thinking covered in Jane Anderson's one-day strategy workshop for women in consulting.
Kim's Advice for Growing an Authentic Consulting Practice
Asked what advice she'd give someone building their own consulting practice, Kim kept it simple: don't try to do everything yourself, get the right people around you at the right time, and lean into your existing expertise rather than starting over.
She also pushes back on the idea that there's one correct way to build a business. In her view, many of the standard models consultants are told to follow were built around male ways of operating, and don't always fit how women in particular experience business or leadership. Her closing advice is to design a practice that reflects your own strengths and way of working, rather than forcing yourself into someone else's model, an approach that echoes the cohort coaching methodology other guests on this show have used to build development models around how people actually learn, rather than a one-size-fits-all template.
As she puts it: "We have to be authentic to who we are."
Frequently Asked Questions
What is the Nine Currencies of Choice model?
It's an employee engagement and retention framework Kim Seeling Smith developed by reverse-engineering insights from roughly 5,000 recruitment interviews conducted over 15 years. It has been used to help organisations significantly improve employee engagement and reduce turnover.
What is an iROC file and how do I create one?
An iROC file is a physical folder where you keep evidence of your professional impact: performance reviews, client thank-you notes, and documented results. When self-doubt or anxiety arises, reviewing the physical file is intended to boost confidence by reminding you of past successes.
How do I know when to hire support in my consulting business?
Kim points to two typical stages: an earlier plateau where operational help (like a virtual assistant for calendar and email management) is usually needed, and a later, higher-growth stage where more strategic support (such as an operations manager) becomes necessary to free up time for thinking and higher-level work.
How can I leverage past career experience when starting a consulting practice?
Rather than treating a previous career as irrelevant, look for the underlying expertise it gave you and apply it to a new problem or audience. Kim did this by turning recruitment interview insights into a retention consulting model: the skill set stayed the same, but the application and packaging changed.
What business model should a consultant use: speaking, training, or coaching?
There's no single correct model. Kim recommends identifying where your genuine strengths lie (for her, that's research and IP creation) and building your delivery mix, speaking, training, consulting, or licensing your IP through affiliates, around that, rather than trying to personally deliver every possible service.
Conclusion
Kim Seeling Smith's career doesn't follow a tidy, linear path, and that's precisely what makes it useful. She didn't abandon her recruitment background when she moved into consulting; she rebuilt it into something new. She didn't try to be a speaker, trainer, coach, and author all at once from day one; she let her business model evolve around her actual strengths. And she didn't pretend imposter syndrome disappears once you've written a book or shared a stage with Richard Branson; she built a simple, concrete tool to manage it.
For anyone building or scaling a consulting practice, the throughline is the same: start with what you already know, design your business around how you actually want to work, and get the right support in place before burnout forces the issue.
Work With Jane Anderson
If you're at the stage where you know you need the right people and the right strategy around you, this is exactly the work covered inside Jane Anderson's Women with Influence community for women building B2B consulting practices.
For more on pricing your expertise appropriately as you grow, see Melissa Lithgow's episode on pricing and positioning after burnout.
Explore more conversations like this one on the Jane Anderson Podcast.
Key Takeaways from Today’s Episode:
-
Jane Anderson introduces her podcast, "The Jane Anderson Brand New Show," targeting experts seeking to enhance their impact, influence, and income in their businesses and careers. She emphasizes the importance of personal connection in business and expresses gratitude for the audience's participation. She shares insights into the current business landscape, noting a mix of virtual and in-person events and advises listeners to focus on building relationships and maintaining their pipelines for sustained success. Jane also promotes an upcoming workshop for women in consulting, positioning it as an opportunity for strategic planning. She introduces the episode's special guest, Kim Seeling Smith, highlighting her expertise as a master storyteller and educator focused on navigating the post-pandemic world.
-
Kim Seeling Smith discusses her career trajectory, beginning with her unintended transition from the hotel industry to accounting due to managerial guidance. Despite initial enthusiasm for the hotel business, she found herself drawn into accounting, ultimately joining KPMG. Recognizing her unsuitability for accounting, she transitioned to recruitment, which she found immensely fulfilling. Over 15 years, she conducted 5,000 interviews, gaining insights that led her to develop a model for employee engagement and retention. She shares anecdotes of its success, including significant improvements in employee engagement for various organizations.
-
Jane reflects on Kim's career evolution, praising her for leveraging her past experiences to create impactful consulting practices. Kim emphasizes the importance of embracing one's expertise and adapting it to meet evolving needs, rather than discarding it. She discusses her transition from recruitment to strategic consulting, emphasizing the value of staying true to one's strengths and experience. Jane commends Kim for repackaging her expertise effectively, shifting from recruitment to engagement-focused consulting. They discuss the significance of leveraging past experiences and expertise when building a consulting practice.
-
Kim discusses the evolution of her consulting practice, initially focusing on conference speaking before transitioning to training in response to client de mand. She outlines her current business model, which encompasses speaking, training, and coaching, highlighting the importance of providing impactful solutions tailored to client needs. Kim emphasizes the need for consultants to remain flexible and responsive to client demands while staying true to their core expertise. She shares her journey from conference speaking to training and coaching, driven by client needs and the desire to deliver meaningful solutions.
-
Kim elaborates on the evolution of her consulting practice, detailing her transition from primarily training to a balanced mix of training, consulting, and speaking. She emphasizes her focus on creating impactful programs, such as "Mind Reading for Managers," based on her nine currencies of choice model. Kim highlights her current business model, which includes speaking engagements, consulting projects, and the development of intellectual property, such as her upcoming book on future fit organizations. She discusses her strategy of leveraging her strengths in research and IP creation while collaborating with colleagues to deliver comprehensive solutions.
-
Jane commends Kim's unique consulting model, which leverages affiliates to deliver her programs and services. They discuss the value of creating unique business models tailored to individual strengths and preferences. Kim explains the benefits of affiliate arrangements, enabling her to focus on research and IP creation while affiliates deliver programs to clients. They highlight the importance of finding the right business model that aligns with personal strengths and passions.
-
Kim shares her experiences interacting with Richard Branson and his philanthropic initiatives, particularly the 100% Human at Work program under Virgin Unite. She discusses her involvement in the program's Australian chapter and her recent appointment to a global steering committee. Kim emphasizes the value of surrounding oneself with inspiring individuals who challenge one's thinking and provide diverse perspectives. She reflects on the transformative impact of these experiences and the lessons learned from individuals who have overcome extraordinary challenges.
Jane inquires about the challenges Kim has faced in growing her consulting practice. Kim acknowledges the need for a support system, particularly since the onset of COVID-19, and discusses her efforts to address this by hiring an operations manager and virtual assistant. She reflects on the importance of working smartly rather than solely relying on a strong work ethic, recognizing the need to delegate and prioritize self-care for sustainable growth.
Jane discusses common barriers to growth, such as undervaluing one's expertise and reluctance to delegate. She emphasizes the importance of recognizing one's worth and the need to overcome pricing and support challenges. Kim shares insights into navigating these barriers, highlighting the importance of trust, vulnerability, and surrender in delegating tasks and prioritizing self-worth. They underscore the significance of addressing these issues to achieve sustainable growth and fulfillment in consulting practices.
-
Jane and Kim discuss the challenges associated with extreme growth phases in consulting practices. They highlight the importance of establishing a support system during these periods, emphasizing the transition from operational support to strategic-level assistance. Kim acknowledges the courage required to invest in support services and addresses the prevalence of imposter syndrome among women in consulting. She shares her experience working with a mindset coach and introduces the concept of an "iROC file" as a tool to boost confidence and combat anxiety by documenting evidence of past successes.
-
Kim elaborates on the concept of the "iROC file," explaining its origins and practical application. She describes it as a collection of evidence showcasing one's impact and achievements, such as performance reviews and client feedback. Kim underscores the positive psychological effects of the iROC file, noting its ability to boost confidence and mindset by providing tangible reminders of past successes. Jane expresses enthusiasm for the idea and highlights the value of such a tool in fostering resilience and positivity in consulting practices.
-
Jane prompts Kim to offer advice to listeners aspiring to grow their consulting practices. Kim emphasizes the importance of surrounding oneself with the right support system and leveraging expertise to initiate growth. She advises against attempting to do everything independently and encourages individuals to start with what they know and gradually expand. Kim emphasizes the significance of authenticity in designing one's practice, particularly for women, and encourages listeners to back themselves and honor their unique operating systems.
-
Jane concludes the discussion by commending Kim for her exemplary role as a trailblazer for women in consulting and underscores the importance of authenticity in professional endeavors. She invites listeners to connect with Kim on LinkedIn and explore her website for valuable resources on team management and staff retention. Kim expresses gratitude for the opportunity to share her insights and offers additional resources for interested individuals. Jane thanks Kim for her time and expresses eagerness to have her back on the podcast in the future.
Full Show Transcript:
-
Hi there, my name is Jane Anderson and this is the Jane Anderson Brand New Show. It's the podcast for experts who want to have greater impact, influence and income for their businesses and careers. As experts, we know that people buy from people and work with people who they know, who they like and who they trust.
So I'm so glad you're here because it's that time again now to really amplify how you show up in the world. Hi there and welcome to the Jane Anderson Show. I am so thrilled that you are here today and that we're talking all things women in consulting, women with influence.
We have a very special guest today but before I get into that, I'm going to share a little bit around probably some of the insights and things I'm noticing. I'm doing lots of work, particularly women in our community. I still work with blokes as well but we're doing a lot of work talking about that people are coming back to events here and there.
Still lots of virtual and still lots of Zoom and things like that are still happening. Still virtual studios being set up, been helping a few people with things like that but certainly noticing lots of last minute get togethers, lots of still little bits of last minute planning I would say on behalf of corporate clients. But there's still plenty of opportunity out there.
I think some people are saying to me with uncertainty coming, am I still going to get my clients? What am I going to do? So I still say the same thing, continue to keep building your pipeline.
There are people out there, it's not affecting every single industry so it is important to continue to keep building your pipeline, keep maintaining your relationships. The more that you are known in your industry, the better off you will be. So continue to keep building your communities and knowing the people who really matter in your tribes and staying connected to them and looking after them.
Really everything comes back to nurturing. Nurture your community, nurture your tribe, nurture your clients. And when I say nurture, I mean really about just care.
The more that you care, the more that you have that empathy, kindness, humility in serving, the more that they will continue to want to work with you, the more they will continue to want to trust you because you're the expert. So I have a very special guest today and I want to share with you about them but just a quick reminder that we also have the Ignite Day coming up. We have a one-day workshop for women in consulting working with large organisations and medium organisations is okay too.
And it's a one-day workshop to help you to strategise and build your plan. So sales and marketing, branding and positioning ready for the next 12 months. We've got one coming up in Melbourne, one coming up in Brisbane.
So they're coming up at the end of October and November 2022. So make sure you jump on, jump on the website, jane-anderson.com. Jump on, you'll be able to see the events page there.
Jump on and register. There's some early bird pricing there. So don't miss out.
I'm not working with a massive group. This is intense work. So I can only work with a fairly small group.
So make sure you jump on and grab your spot. In the meantime, let's go to our very special guest today. So our special guest today is a master storyteller, a passionate educator and trend translator.
Kim Seeling Smith helps business leaders move from disruptible to indestructible in the post-pandemic world. As CEO of Ignite Global, Kim consults with organisations around the world, delivering the latest insights and helping them with strategies to increase employee retention, enhance employee experience and organisational culture and understand and embrace the future of work and the future workforce. So I look forward to hearing your thoughts, comments.
Please reach out to me. I'd love to hear your reflections on today's interview with Kim.
-
So welcome, Kim.
Thank you so much for joining us today. I know you are one very busy lady. So thank you for agreeing to catch up with us.
So many questions that I want to ask you. You have had a truly extraordinary career and have an incredible consulting practice, as we said in the introduction. How on earth did you get into all this?
[Speaker 1] (4:37 - 7:47)
Ah, well, it's interesting because my career has taken several twists and turns. I like to fashion myself or call myself a recovering accountant, because that really informs a lot of what I do, because I, like so many of us, took some very well-meaning advice by somebody that I trusted and respected at the age of 19 that led me completely in the wrong direction. So I was working in the hotel industry.
I loved the hotel business. I was working front desk, loved the people-oriented nature of the job. And that was what I was going to do.
I was going to become a hotel general manager. So my GM at the time put me into a management and training program. And the very first place that he put me was accounting, because he said, you see the whole hotel come together.
So I did that for a couple of years. And he was transferred. And what I was supposed to do is rotate between the different departments, but I got stuck in accounting.
So I thought, well, as long as I'm doing this, I might as well go get a degree to learn how to do it better, all the while thinking I'd go back into the hotel industry. But once you get into university and study accounting, and I went to Ohio State, which was a very well-ranked university in accounting at that time, still is probably, I don't know. But you get kind of swept up into the big firms.
So I ended up joining KPMG. And I spent five years trying to succeed as an accountant, failing miserably. And I finally recognized.
Yeah, yeah. And I finally recognized that the common denominator in all of these jobs that weren't working out was me. And now part of what I teach is strengths.
And I realized that detail is not one of my strengths. So can you imagine what a horrible accountant I am? I mean, terrible.
So luckily, I fell into what ended up being the greatest professional mistake of my career, which was I was working on the board of a not-for-profit in Dallas, Texas. And you can tell by my accent I'm not from around these parts. But I fell into a job as a recruiter through really being recruited by a woman that I was on the board of this not-for-profit with.
And I decided that I would give myself 90 days to test it out. And within 30, I knew that I'd found my niche in life. I absolutely loved doing what I did.
During that 15 years, it got me from the United States, first to New Zealand, and then to Australia. And after 15 wonderful years working as a recruitment consultant, I decided that instead of being paid to put bums in seats, I wanted to help organizations keep the right people in the right seats using the treasure trove of knowledge that I gained from 5,000 interviews of candidates who walked through my door as a recruiter. So that's the short version.
[Speaker 2] (7:48 - 8:07)
Just incredible, Kim, 5,000 interviews. So these are in that recruitment career that you had, like that body of knowledge and insights that you must have got from that, what have been some of the highlights? What are some of the things that you found out of those interviews that really stand out?
[Speaker 1] (8:07 - 10:00)
Oh, it's so interesting because this is the very... So my timing was impeccable because when I decided this, I had just moved to Australia with the intention. I was working with a multinational that initially brought me over to New Zealand, a company that I'd worked for on and off for 15 years.
Well, I worked for them for 13 years and took a two-year break in between. And my agreement when I moved to Australia was that I was going to work part-time in recruitment and part-time building this business. And I really had very little idea what this business was.
And then the GFC hit. So nobody was hiring consultants to, you know, engage and retain their staff. So I had about a year and a half to really think through this, which was the best gift that I possibly could have been given.
So what I did is I reverse engineered these 5,000 exit interviews and I created my very first model. And I call it the currencies of choice, the nine currencies of choice. And it has been extraordinarily successful in helping organizations engage and retain staff, like off the charts, off the charts, bottom line results.
I had one organization, the IT department of a heavy equipment manufacturer, go from having the lowest employee engagement to the highest and beating the next highest by 23 points. In other companies, it reduced employee return over by, you know, 10 or 15 points, just wildly successful. Now that model has only been updated twice actually, because I'm a, you know, if you look at my profile on the Colby scale, I'm a seven fact finder.
So I'm always doing research. And I did some deep dive into the great resignation. And so that model has been updated then.
So it's really one of my foundational models for employee engagement and retention.
[Speaker 2] (10:03 - 10:47)
That's incredible, Kim. You know, what I love about that is, you know, when we're building a consulting practice, you know, we've got often this whole body of work that we've spent years on doing, but what you've done is evolved it into something and packaged it up. So instead of it just sitting there and going, oh, well, that was my past life.
I don't want to do that. If I go out and start my consulting practice, I'll go this way, is you've actually, well, hang on. Why don't we use this?
But you've redefined how that's packaged up, redefined how people buy you the currency, as opposed to it being recruitment needs, is packaging it up into a different currency, which is actually about engagement.
[Speaker 1] (10:48 - 12:33)
And it's really interesting that you say that, Jane, because I used to see that as a recruitment consultant, people would come into my office and they would be frustrated by something that was happening in their day-to-day life, you know, in their day-to-day work lives. And instead of making a little bit of a shift, they would want to throw the baby out with the bathwater. And I think that's human nature.
And I think that, you know, I know a lot of your listeners are either just starting their practice or are thinking about, you know, leaving corporate and, you know, doing something on their own. And that's one of the best pieces of advice that I could give them is to really leverage your expertise. Don't get caught up.
And I have to tell you, you know, especially during the GFC, I fashioned myself in a couple of different ways, prior to really saying, what am I doing? You know, stick to your knitting. You have this treasure trove of information.
And so now my business is all about, yes, talent attraction, absolutely, because with my experience, that's a way that I can really help organizations, employee engagement and retention, as I've just said. And then over the last few years, I've really up-leveled to do more strategic consulting and speaking around the future of work. And sorry about that.
It's okay. We can edit that out. You're in hot demand, Kim.
I forgot to turn it. Oops. Okay.
And I answered it instead of, so I have no idea who that was, but anyway. Sorry. Let's start, what was the question again?
No, no, no, I'll answer it all.
[Speaker 2] (12:35 - 12:47)
It was, you said it's a really, an opportunity to really use that treasure trove of that work that you've got, rather than sort of dismissing it, is being up-to-date, isn't it?
[Speaker 1] (12:47 - 13:55)
That's one of the best pieces of advice, is leverage your experience. Do not negate your experience. And it's human nature to think that, and you can evolve over time.
Obviously, I started with employee retention, and then I realized very quickly that with the expertise that I had, I could also teach talent attraction and in a very unique and different way. There's nobody teaching talent attraction the way I'm teaching it. And then over time, over the last probably three or four years, I've evolved into a more strategic offering around the future of work.
And I've created an eight step roadmap for a future fit organization. And now I'm really playing with a lot of C-suite leaders, helping them prepare for, well, not even the future, prepare for now and understand the trends that are happening around the future of work. Let's face it, the rules around the future of work are being rewritten on a daily basis.
So you can evolve over time, but my advice is to stick to your knitting initially. Yes.
[Speaker 2] (13:57 - 14:16)
And Kim, so as part of your practice, in terms of the modes of delivery, so are you happy to share what that looks like in your practice? Like, are you doing a bit of speaking or a bit of every mode, like speaking, training, coaching, or what does your business model look like ideally?
[Speaker 1] (14:17 - 16:10)
I fell into training. Initially, I wanted to be a conference speaker. That's how I started off.
And then I fell into training because my clients were demanding this. They were saying, develop a program that would help us really make an impact. I mean, it's great to start a conversation, but let's look at a program.
So I developed this program called Mind Reading for Managers, which is based on the nine currencies of choice model. I wrote a book called Mind Reading for Managers, which really outlines the conversations that you can have around the currencies of choice. And the first few years that I was in business, I probably did mostly training with some consulting and a very little bit of speaking, but I've still really wanted to be on conference stages.
I love sparking that conversation. So over time, I've built my speaking practice. I've decreased the training so that I'm probably 40% training, 40% consulting with 20% speaking now.
And I've obviously written the book. I'm working with a wonderful mentor named Jane Anderson, who's helping me write my next book, which will be about this future fit organization, the Eight Step Roadmap. So this is really where I want to play.
And I've developed a structure based on the Eight Step Roadmap that will help organizations over time really embrace all eight steps. And I'm bringing in a number of my colleagues to deliver the pieces, because again, I'm very familiar with my strengths and weaknesses. So I'm developing relationships with colleagues to bring in, to do the pieces that really aren't in my wheelhouse.
[Speaker 2] (16:12 - 17:35)
Yes, that's such a valuable insight, Kim, because as you grow in your practice, and I'm sure you've been through this, is that we go, okay, we've got to do, and it's part of growth, is we're going, okay, I've got to do speaking, and I've got to go over here and do training, and then I'll go over here and do some coaching, and I'll do some mentoring. And I know you've got a massive remit of online materials and support, coaching, online courses. You really are just trying to work out, I think, your own strengths and just the energy flow in your own practice of what you love to do, because there's only one of you.
So it's nearly impossible to, and you do hit this point, though, in your practice where you go, you know what? I can't do all six modes, if it's speaker, author, trainer, facilitator, coach, and mentor being consulting, advisory, all that in there. So working out what is the mode and how my business model is designed.
So what you're saying is that you know that your strength is really around that fact finder and being involved in research. So being able to generate or create the IP, the tools, the resources. So yes, you consult, but enabling and leveraging your IP that others can be delivering it, is that right?
Absolutely, absolutely.
[Speaker 1] (17:35 - 18:36)
That's really the next evolution is to train others in delivering that. I've got that program ready to go. Well, it's going.
I've got a train-the-trainer developed for the Mind Reading for Managers program. And that is now available in a completely digital on-demand modality. So I've got affiliates in the States and in Australia who are selling that program on my behalf, but then it's their clients.
So they're picking up a number of different add-on work for them in terms of coaching and other workshops that they can run. So it's really a win-win. These affiliate agreements, these affiliate arrangements are really a win-win because it gives them something proven and tangible that will make a remarkable difference, but then they can upsell with some of the things that they offer as well.
[Speaker 2] (18:37 - 19:30)
Right, I love that. And so then you get to stay in your space of continually advancing the thinking and finding the research and being that translator and not getting bogged down too much in the delivery. And I really like the model.
I think it's a great model for those who are listening sometimes and to see a different version. You've got a really unique practice, Kim, in terms of I think what's possible because I think sometimes it's easy to go, oh, well, yeah, I think I need to create a training organization and put on contractors and I'll just run the programs. And we can't sometimes see another way around that, but you've got a really interesting model in terms of these affiliates and they don't have to, because there's a lot of people, I think sometimes if they're an expert thought leader, especially in these spaces, we think isn't everybody just creating their own IP, but not necessarily.
[Speaker 1] (19:30 - 20:05)
Some people really need these tools. Absolutely, and I find people, especially people who are starting out who haven't created their IP. And there are other people who I know personally who really, that's not their strength.
They don't want to create their own IP. They really want to curate IP from other people and put it together in a suite of programs that specifically fits their customer's needs. So that's been a successful business strategy for a number of my friends actually have done that.
[Speaker 2] (20:07 - 20:48)
Yeah, it's a really valuable model. And I think there's so many versions that people can create for this. And I love that you're creating the version that works for you and what you love to do.
Tell us, we have to ask because I'll be, I won't be forgiven if I don't ask you. You've got the Necker Island behind you. You've, as I've read in your bio, you've obviously been involved with Richard Branson and the work that he's involved in.
You've sat at the table. There's a, I think on some of the photos I've seen, you're actually sitting next to him at an event. So tell us what that experience was like.
[Speaker 1] (20:48 - 23:16)
That experience has been remarkable, quite frankly. I've had a chance to spend six days in total with Sir Richard and the first three days were at Necker Island. And can I tell you, Richard wasn't even the most interesting person at that event because I was there with George and Amal Clooney as well.
And eight months- Oh, as you do? Eight months with them. So that was quite exciting.
And then I was invited with a group of just 15 people to spend three days at his wildlife refuge in, well, not refuge, but his wildlife sanctuary, I guess, in South Africa, which was a dream come true for me. And I've just been, so the reason for this involvement is there's an initiative that falls under his philanthropic arm. His philanthropic arm is called Virgin Unite, and there's an initiative called 100% Human at Work, which has been going since 2014 or 2015.
And I found out about 100% Human, and it really resonates with my DNA, with creating organizations that are both commercially smart, but also are organizations that have cultures where their people can thrive. Because I truly, truly believe that we need to reimagine work. I mean, look at the stats around the Great Resignation.
Look at what's happening in the marketplace. Look at the critical skills shortage. We have to re-envision this.
And so 100% Human at Work was a natural alignment for me. I initially was invited to take the place of somebody who had been invited to Necker Island. And then I got to know the Virgin Unite community, so I keep getting invited back.
And in fact, I was one of the foundational members of the committee that brought 100% Human at Work here to Australia, where after a two-year sort of hiatus, we're reinvigorating it. We're having our first in-person gathering in November of this year. And I'll tell you a secret.
Just between you and I and our listeners, I was just asked to be one of 15 people on a global steering committee for 100% Human at Work, which is a dream come true for me. So that's how I get to hang out with Sir Richard from time to time.
[Speaker 2] (23:18 - 23:42)
Oh, how inspiring. That's just incredible, Kim. Just to have an experience like that, to see someone who has just achieved so much.
What do you think has been, what do you think the value is around surrounding yourself with, doesn't always have to be Richard Branson, but around people who help you to really think bigger and strive?
[Speaker 1] (23:43 - 25:41)
Yeah, you would probably know because you're such a great person with quotes and gosh, you're the most organized person I've ever seen in my life in terms of, oh, I remember seeing something in 2013. Let me just find that for you. 15 seconds later, it's in my inbox.
Never, never experienced that before. So you'll probably remember who said this, but there was somebody who said that the quality of your life or the level of success that you will attain are directly equivalent to the top five people that you surround yourself with. I'm horribly paraphrasing.
Was that Jim Rohn? Okay, I knew you'd know that. I knew you'd know that.
So I really take that to heart and I love being in rooms where I am the dumbest poorest person in that room. I love surrounding myself with people that just really challenged my level of thinking. I walk away from those just being so incredibly energized, those experiences.
So I just, I think that it helps you, you're breathing different air and you're having different conversations. I won't say that it's directly added to my bottom line in terms of have I picked up clients as a result of this? Probably not, but what it's done is it's helped me think differently and really challenged myself and really cross-pollinate my thinking with other people from very diverse backgrounds.
You know, attempting to overcome very diverse challenges. Because I think that there's a lot of gold that can be gleaned from other people's experiences in completely different areas. So that's what those experiences have done.
[Speaker 2] (25:42 - 26:00)
Oh, I've got goosebumps. Kim, I've got this quote here from you, which is a little gem. I reckon you get the right people around you, you start breathing different air.
I love that. I'll be putting your quotes out to people now. Excellent.
That would be right. I love that.
[Speaker 1] (26:00 - 26:33)
It does feel like that, doesn't it? It does. It really does.
It really does. And you know, and it also, it humbles you because a lot of the people in these rooms have overcome extraordinary circumstances. So not only are they doing extraordinary things for the planet, they've overcome extraordinary circumstances to be able to do these things.
And it really, you know, it challenges me and humbles me at the same time. Yes.
[Speaker 2] (26:34 - 26:38)
And Kim, what's been the biggest challenge for you in growing your practice?
[Speaker 1] (26:41 - 28:36)
Well, you and I are working on this right now, getting the right support system around me. I, especially since COVID, I haven't had any support system around me. I've been trying, you know, I've been the lone ranger trying to do it all and you just can't do it all, nor should you do it all.
I let my assistant go during the early days of COVID because we didn't know what was going to happen. And she then got a full-time job and I just never replaced her. And I recognized after going through a really major bout of burnout about nine months ago, I recognized the toll that it was taking.
So I'm, you know, I'm making great strides in pulling the team around me. I've got, now I've got a part-time operations manager who's been on board about six weeks and really, you know, starting to kick some goals there. It looks like we found a VA that is going to be a tremendous support system to me.
And so once I get that really shorn up, then that'll free up my time. You know, and it's like, you know, plumbers taps. I teach people about strengths and weaknesses and utilizing your time, but have I followed my own advice?
No, I haven't. And part of that, you know, part of that comes from how I was raised. I was raised with a tremendous work ethic.
And so, you know, my philosophy has always been just work harder. And it's just, you know, there comes a point in time where you just can't work harder. You've got to work smart.
So that's my, that is my intention over the next few years is to work smart and to continue to up level and do what I love to do, make a bigger impact and have more ease and fun in my life.
[Speaker 2] (28:37 - 31:14)
Yeah, that's what we want. I love hearing that, Kim, because I know for a lot of particularly women that listen to the podcast is, you know, they often, I find there's two phases where they kind of hit a wall of, I just can't go any further. I can't seem to break through this wall of, do I change my offering?
Do I start selling online courses? You know, there's all this, what do I need to do? And there's the first wall, and I reckon it sort of kicks in around that too, that 200,000 mark where we're not, the actual real problem is we're not really valuing ourself.
We're not valuing our time. We're not valuing our expertise. So there's actually more so a pricing problem and initial support problem that you don't have to keep doing it all.
It's time to start to offload. And that takes a lot of trust, vulnerability, surrendering a little bit and realising that this is, you are going through, even just realising you're going through a growth period, so an extreme growth. So I think getting that support system around at that stage is often hard.
And then there's the other one that happens where there's a real levelling up because you're shifting through positioning into leverage and distribution. And so you're coming out of, because you've done quite a lot of media, you are known in this space around the future of work, the tools that you've created, the clients you've worked with, the stages you've spoken on. It's now this different level of leveraging because once you've sort of identified where you bring your greatest value in terms of the modes.
So if that speaking, and particularly in yours, is speaking, authoring, and advisory, those three, then, okay, we've got to get, we just can't keep working more. We've got to somehow create space for you to think. Yeah.
Absolutely. Keep going that way. And that's a different level, which is interesting.
You talk about an operations manager coming in now and being able to, it's a little bit more strategic type level of working with navigating through that next phase. That first one is really about, I need a VA to do my calendar emails, you know, that sort of thing. But now it's bringing in a little bit higher levels of support.
And I think there's those that listen to the show sometimes, there's a lot of courage that comes with that, isn't there? Because you think, this is a lot of money. You know, if I've got to outlay this support, am I actually going to get a return out of this?
Am I actually going to get these days down?
[Speaker 1] (31:15 - 33:29)
And the other thing that I would say is, especially women, you know, the imposter syndrome is a thing. And there are so many women who just do not back themselves in terms of, and I suffer from it as well at every level. You know, they just don't back themselves in terms of the quality of their IP, the quality of their experience and what they have to offer.
I personally have spent the last almost year working with a mindset coach to really help me, help me with that. And that's been tremendously successful. But one of the best tools that I use personally and that I teach my clients to use is called an iROC file.
And it was a little American because Americans are fond of saying, you rock. So I created this. I created this by accident for a client that was really having some anxiety issues.
And what I do is I have them collect evidence of the impact that they've made. So performance reviews, thank you notes from clients, results from clients. And when I, and if you're really having a bad time and this has to be a physical file folder so you can flip through it and read these things.
And what it does is it just fills your body with dopamine. Dopamine is like Pac-Man for cortisol. So the anxiety dissipates and you really start to feel more confident.
And everybody goes through ups and downs and in this world, the ups and downs are coming more frequently. I use that file myself just to remind myself, especially if I've got a scary client meeting or if I'm embarking on a project that I'm not 100% sure that I know, that I feel comfortable with. I'll just use that to remind myself that I've been successful in the past.
I will be successful now. I've got this physical file of evidence saying I rock. Yes.
[Speaker 2] (33:29 - 33:51)
Oh, that's such a fantastic idea, Kim. The difference that that must make to just, that could just totally change your energy in a day to go to another client. Like anything you can do to sort of hack that and disrupt that thinking.
So you actually, if they're emails, you actually print them and put them in that physical file and have them nice and visible, yeah?
[Speaker 1] (33:51 - 35:28)
On your desk or something? And some of my clients, one of my clients even put together, she was into scrapbooking and she put together this like notebook with rocks on the top of it. And this like beautiful presentation.
I am not that creative, but I fell into this. I create all of my best ideas by accident. Truly, I do create all my best ideas by accident.
But I fell into this when I was moving between New Zealand and Australia. I was cleaning out files. And I was really nervous because I knew that I'm going to start my own business.
I knew that it wasn't going to be in recruitment. I didn't really know what it was going to be. And I really had some hesitation about, can I do this?
And I was cleaning out files and I kept, I saved everything. So I've got a personal handwritten note written by the CEO of the company that actually moved me from the US to New Zealand and then to Australia. The CEO was in my office in 1994.
No, it was later than that, 96 or something like that. And was impressed by what he saw and he wrote me a handwritten note, which I still have to my, I can reach behind me and get that note. So I can't find the stacks like you can, but I can find handwritten notes.
And so when I was cleaning out file folders, I was consolidating all of these. And as you do, you have a tendency to read them. And I recognized how confident I began to feel and how happy I began to feel.
And I went, you know, I think this is a thing. I'm going to create a file folder and I called it my iROC file.
[Speaker 2] (35:29 - 36:06)
iROC file. We so need a iROC file. So if you're thinking and you're listening to this today, go fill out, go create your iROC file.
I know I'm definitely going to be doing that, Kim. That's such a fantastic idea because, you know, let's face it, you know, we're on our own. We don't always get enough positive feedback and encouragement and things like that.
So they really are so valuable to hang on to. And I love that I'm not really a hoarder either, but something like that is something so valuable to hang on to because look how long that you've kept that for. And that person and what that meant for you.
That's terrific.
[Speaker 1] (36:07 - 36:07)
Yeah.
-
Kim, in terms of someone who might be listening today has got their practice, they go, oh, Kim is so amazing. Like they're looking at your website, they're seeing the book you've written, like they're going, oh God. So if, you know, if there was someone listening to you, what advice would you have for them in terms of running and growing a consulting practice?
[Speaker 1] (36:30 - 37:08)
Yeah, I would say, don't do what I did. You know, surround yourself with the right people. Don't try and do it all.
Get the right team in place at the right time. You've got a tremendous model to follow. And I'm really starting to backfill on some of the steps that I missed and I can see that it's gonna pay dividends.
So surround yourself with the right people and leverage your expertise. Start from there and then grow. I know it's really attractive to go off and do something completely different, but start with what you know and grow.
Start with what you know and grow. That's, there's another saying.
[Speaker 2] (37:08 - 37:09)
I like that.
[Speaker 1] (37:09 - 37:15)
There's another quote, Kim quote. I love them. And back yourself, absolutely back yourself.
[Speaker 2] (37:15 - 38:41)
Oh yeah. And back yourself. Great.
Yeah, you've been through a lot, Kim, in terms of not just, I'm always in awe of you because not just because of the quality of your work and what you've been able to do and leveraging all your expertise, but you have moved around the world doing this and you have adapted to new people and new roles and you've taken on incredible roles in PSA here in Australia. Kim did an amazing job as conference convener for our PSA conference. You really are playing at the pointy end but you're a real trailblazer, I think, for women in this space who go, here's a version of this that you could do.
And I love that you're designing your practice around who you are as an amazing human being, as an incredible woman, and to be able to say, well, here's my version of living the dream. Here's my version of what I want it to look like. So I think you're a real, yeah, you're a real fantastic, incredible role model for those who, because I know when I started, I was like, I just was trying to find, tell me all the stories of these women of how they do all this and what does a version look like?
Because sometimes it's hard to understand, it's hard to say, and then your practice is really unique again. So- I think you have to be authentic to who you are.
[Speaker 1] (38:41 - 39:23)
And I think that too often, women try to mold themselves into other models. And let's face it, most of the models that are out there are male models, which don't always work for us. We have a different operating system.
From a brain perspective, our brains are identical, but we have a different operating system, be it the environment that we've all grown up in, our societal expectations, whatever it is, we do have a different operating system. And I think that we have to honor that. And we have to be authentic, male or female, we have to be authentic to who we are.
[Speaker 2] (39:24 - 39:45)
Yeah. What a great way to finish on, to be authentic to who you are, because let's face it, there's only one of you, we might as well make the most of it if we're going to go this way. So Kim, if people want to follow you, find out more about you, where would you like to go?
What do you want them to do to connect with you or- Two places.
[Speaker 1] (39:46 - 40:32)
Two places, LinkedIn, definitely connect with me on LinkedIn. I am the only Kim Seelingsmith on the planet. And I regularly post value add, well, I hope it's value add, value add content on LinkedIn, but also my website.
If somebody who's listening has a team and they're struggling with attraction retention, there's a free white paper that I've got on the homepage of my website, which is https://kimseelingsmith.com/. They can download the free white paper, which is the nine keys to avoid the great resignation. It's my nine currencies of choice unpacked.
So I would invite you to download that and to use that as a model for engaging and retaining your own staff.
[Speaker 2] (40:33 - 40:55)
Fantastic. We'll put all the links on there for you when we publish the podcast. So if you're looking for where those are, you'll see those on the website.
But Kim, thank you so much for your time. I was so glad- Thank you, Jane. I was able to fit in.
I will always make time for you. You are so kind. Thank you so much.
And we can't wait to have you back. Thanks, Jane.
Most of the guests interviewed are current or alumni members of the Women With Influence community. Click here to find out more
