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You know your material. You've rehearsed the pitch, prepared the board update, or practised the keynote a dozen times. And yet, something still isn't landing the way it should.
You come off stage with a tight neck. Your mouth goes dry halfway through a meeting. People nod politely, but you can feel that they're not quite as persuaded, or as trusting, as you'd expect them to be.
According to Dr Louise Mahler, Australia's 2021 Keynote Speaker of the Year and a leadership body-language and voice expert, that gap usually has nothing to do with your knowledge, your nerves, or your personality. It's physical.
Mahler's career path is an unusual one for a communication expert. She began with a degree in economics and statistics, spent a decade as a professional opera singer with a soloist's contract at the Vienna State Opera, and later completed a Master's in Organisational Psychology and a PhD in Business. That combination (technical rigour, trained vocal performance, and academic research) is the foundation for a specific and useful idea: your voice is not separate from your body, and the tension you carry physically is the single biggest thing shaping how credible, trustworthy, and confident you sound.
This article breaks down Mahler's framework, what she calls the mind-body-voice connection, the three physical habits most likely to be undermining your credibility right now, and why the usual advice ("just speak more slowly," "be more confident") rarely works.
What Is the Mind-Body-Voice Connection?
The mind-body-voice connection is Mahler's model for understanding communication problems. It states that vocal and communication issues, such as sounding tense, rushed, aggressive, or unconvincing, are almost always caused by physical tension in the body, not by a person's mindset or personality.
"The basis of my work is the mind body voice connection," Mahler explains. "Everything starts in the mind... but if you go back to the mind, it's too slow."
That last point matters. Most communication advice tries to fix the problem at the level of the mind: thinking more positively, feeling more confident, reframing your nerves. Mahler's approach skips that step entirely. Instead, she works with the body, because the body changes fast and the voice is simply the audible result of what the body is doing.
If someone is clenching their jaw, Mahler can hear it. If someone is breathing high in their chest, she can hear that too. And crucially, she argues, so can everyone else in the room, even if they can't consciously name what they're hearing.
This isn't just a coaching anecdote. Peer-reviewed research on paralinguistic cues and evaluative judgments has found that listeners form appraisals of a speaker's confidence and competence from vocal characteristics alone, independent of what's actually being said.
Why This Matters More Than Most People Realise
Most professionals assume that if their content is strong enough, their delivery is a secondary concern. Mahler's work suggests the opposite: physical tension shapes how your voice sounds, and how your voice sounds shapes whether people trust you, often before they've fully processed what you've said.
This is precisely why the physical habits below are worth identifying. They're not stylistic quirks. They're structural issues that quietly cost credibility in rooms where credibility is the entire point.
The Three Physical Habits That Undermine Your Credibility
Mahler points to three specific, observable habits that show up again and again in professionals, particularly those under pressure to perform, present, or lead.
1. Jaw Tension and Clenching
Jaw tension is one of the most common, and most damaging, habits Mahler identifies in her clients.
"If somebody has their jaw tension... you can hear clearly that they have a tension in the jaw," she says. On its own, that might just sound like a minor speech quirk. But the consequences run deeper. Left unaddressed, Mahler warns, jaw clenching can grind down teeth, make the tongue lazy, accelerate visible signs of ageing, and eventually pull tension into the neck, spine, and breath.
The immediate perception problem is just as significant: a clenched jaw reads as angry, tight, or aggressive, even when that's not the speaker's intention at all.
2. High, Shallow Breathing
The second habit is breathing "high": using the chest and shoulders rather than the diaphragm to draw breath.
Mahler describes the correct mechanics simply: "The stomach goes in, which squeezes the air out of the lungs." When people breathe high instead, they restrict airflow, tighten the throat, and change the sound and stability of their voice, often without realising why they suddenly feel less in control.
3. Speaking Too Fast for Your Own Breath
The third habit is pace: specifically, speaking faster than your breath support can sustain.
This one is personal for Mahler. "Because I have no ear, I speak really quickly," she admits. And the common advice, just slow down, doesn't actually solve the underlying issue. "I actually can't speak more slowly," she says. "It's all about getting your body lined up, getting the air down."
In other words, pace isn't a willpower problem. It's a breath-support problem. Fix the breathing, and the pace often corrects itself.
Why "Just Speak More Slowly" Doesn't Work
This is the point where most generic public-speaking advice falls short. Telling someone to "slow down," "relax," or "be more confident" addresses the symptom, not the mechanism.
Mahler's clients don't usually describe their problem in technical terms. They describe it emotionally: "I have lost my confidence." She's heard it so often, she jokes, that she'd be rich if she had a penny for every time.
But her diagnosis is rarely about confidence as a trait. It's about credibility and trust as a direct consequence of physical habits. "You will lose trust if you're holding your breath," she says. "People don't trust people who break the sound like that. And you can't have influence because you can't get through all of that trust and credibility to have influence."
This reframe matters because it changes where the fix needs to happen. If the problem is genuinely psychological, the solution is confidence-building exercises, mindset work, or exposure therapy. If the problem is physical (a locked jaw, high breathing, a pace outmatched by breath support), then confidence-building alone won't touch it. The body has to be addressed directly.
The trust link isn't just anecdotal, either. Research from the University of Pennsylvania's Wharton School on how vocal delivery persuades found that a speaker's vocal confidence can shift how persuasive their message is, even when the words themselves don't change. Separately, NIH-published research on vocal trust has shown that listeners form trust judgments from vocal delivery that can persist even after a speaker's actual trustworthiness becomes evident, underlining just how much is riding on the voice itself, not only the message.
The Professional Line: What Vocal Mastery Actually Looks Like
Mahler uses a simple visual model to describe what progress and mastery look like over time.
Picture a graph. The X-axis represents time: engagement after engagement, presentation after presentation. The Y-axis represents performance excellence. Early on, most people's performance bounces unpredictably: sometimes strong, sometimes weak, rarely consistent.
Somewhere on that graph sits what Mahler calls "the line of excellence": the point at which performance becomes reliably professional. Most people cross it occasionally. Mastery, in her definition, means staying above that line consistently, even on an off day.
"You have to be able to perform under water," she says. "It has to be under control." That control isn't built in the moment of performance. It's built beforehand, through technique that's practised enough to become automatic. As Mahler puts it, "you only ever use five percent of your mind for your technique" during an actual performance; the rest of the work has to already be done.
This is also why she's sceptical of over-preparation as a strategy on its own. Without a clear framework guiding the engagement, more rehearsal time doesn't reliably produce more consistency. What produces consistency is addressing the physical fundamentals (jaw, breath, pace) until they no longer need conscious attention at all. The same reliance on a repeatable framework, rather than raw effort, shows up in how other experts on the show structure their own high-stakes work. See how facilitator Jacinta Cubis distinguishes facilitation from training.
From Confidence Loss to Confidence Rebuilt
It's worth being precise about what Mahler is, and isn't, claiming. She's not arguing that mindset, preparation, or experience don't matter. She's arguing that when professionals experience a specific, recurring pattern (technically competent, but somehow not landing, not trusted, not "confident" in delivery), the first place to look is the body, not the mind.
This reframing tends to be a relief for the people she works with. A confidence problem can feel like a personal, difficult-to-fix flaw. A jaw-tension problem, a breathing-pattern problem, or a pace problem is concrete, observable, and, critically, trainable. It's a similar shift to the one Sue Anderson describes when reframing feedback as a fixable skill rather than a personal failing: naming the concrete mechanism removes the sting and makes the fix actionable.
That's the throughline of Mahler's entire practice: analysis first (what's actually happening physically), then a body-language and health lens (what this tension is costing the person, not just how it looks to others), and finally skills and transformation (retraining the specific habit).
How Louise Built a Practice Without Traditional Marketing
There's a second, quieter lesson running through Mahler's story, one that's directly relevant to consultants, coaches, and experts building their own practice.
Mahler has built a globally recognised practice, coaching CEOs, federal politicians, and international business leaders, almost entirely without traditional marketing. "All of my work comes from people who know me," she says. "It's very hard to sell work... people don't get the work until they see it."
Her advice to other experts is characteristically direct: "Get up and do, do, do, do, do. I don't have any smart marketing strategies. I just work." In practice, that means staying in contact with her professional network, following up, and consistently delivering work strong enough that clients return and refer her.
This matters because Mahler operates in a genuinely under-served niche. As she explains, there are roughly 32 recognised fields of voice work, but almost none of them address voice specifically for business professionals. Speech pathologists look for medical issues. Singing teachers look for singers. Actors look for performers. "There's few people who can help you in the every day," she says, which is precisely the gap her work fills.
She's also used public visibility strategically, most notably a viral body-language analysis of Amber Heard that reached 2.7 million views, not as an end in itself, but as a way to demonstrate expertise to people who might later want the deeper, transformational coaching work. As she puts it, media appearances are "the lowest common denominator": entertaining, simplified, and useful for visibility, but not a substitute for the real coaching relationship.
That balance between visible presence and depth of practice is a recurring theme among the consultants featured on the show. See how Maya Nova approaches mindful leadership under pressure for another angle on staying composed and credible in high-visibility moments. For more conversations with leading consultants and coaches, browse the full Jane Anderson Show podcast library.
Frequently Asked Questions
Why does my voice sound tense when I'm speaking or presenting?
Vocal tension usually starts in the body, not the voice itself. Common physical causes include jaw clenching, breathing high in the chest instead of the diaphragm, and speaking faster than your breath can support. These habits change how your voice sounds, often without you noticing them directly.
Is a tense or strained voice caused by nerves, or something physical?
It can be either, but Dr Louise Mahler's work focuses specifically on physical causes (tension held in the jaw, throat, neck, and breathing pattern) that persist regardless of how nervous or prepared a person feels. Addressing the physical habit directly is often faster than trying to manage nerves alone.
How does vocal tension affect how trustworthy I sound?
According to Mahler, listeners register vocal tension, even unconsciously, as a lack of ease or control, which reduces perceived trustworthiness. "You will lose trust if you're holding your breath," she says. Since influence depends on trust, unresolved vocal tension can directly limit how persuasive someone is, regardless of their content.
Can vocal tension be fixed quickly, or does it take months of training?
Because the issues are physical and specific (a locked jaw, a breathing pattern, a pace mismatch), they can often be identified and improved relatively quickly once someone knows what to look for. Long-term consistency (staying "above the professional line") takes ongoing practice, but the initial diagnosis and correction can happen fast.
What's the difference between confidence and credibility when speaking?
Confidence is an internal feeling; credibility is how trustworthy and capable you sound to others. Mahler's clients often describe their problem as "losing confidence," but the underlying issue is usually a credibility problem caused by physical habits, meaning the fix is technical, not purely psychological.
Who is Dr Louise Mahler?
Dr Louise Mahler is Australia's 2021 Keynote Speaker of the Year, a leadership body-language and voice expert, and executive coach. She holds a PhD in Business and a Master's in Organisational Psychology, previously worked as a professional opera singer with a soloist contract at the Vienna State Opera, and is the author of "Resonate," published by Penguin Random House.
Conclusion
The instinct to treat vocal and communication struggles as a confidence issue is understandable: that's how they feel from the inside. But Dr Louise Mahler's work offers a more useful, more actionable reframe: most of what undermines credibility when you speak is physical, specific, and correctable. A locked jaw, a high breathing pattern, a pace that's outrunning your breath: these aren't personality traits. They're habits, and habits can be retrained.
For consultants, coaches, and leaders whose influence depends on being heard, trusted, and believed, that's genuinely good news. The fix isn't a personality overhaul. It's technique.
Work With Jane Anderson
Want to build the kind of visible, credible practice Louise describes? Explore Women with Influence, Jane Anderson's community for consultants and thought leaders building world-class practices by design, or listen to the full conversation with Dr Louise Mahler on Apple Podcasts.
Key Takeaways from Today’s Episode:
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In this part of the transcript, Jane Anderson introduces herself and her podcast, the Jane Anderson Brand New Show, aimed at experts seeking to enhance their impact, influence, and income. She expresses excitement to have Louise, an esteemed guest, on the show. Louise, an expert in her field, shares her background, starting with a degree in economics and statistics, transitioning to opera singing, and eventually returning to the business world. Louise describes her journey as following her heart rather than a predetermined career path, driven by a passion for helping people perform better in public speaking. Jane and Louise discuss Louise's varied modes of delivery, including motivational speaking, training, coaching, and retreats. Louise emphasizes her focus on body language, health, and transformation in her work.
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Louise elaborates on her modes of delivery, highlighting motivational speaking, training (referred to as "mini events"), coaching, and retreats. She explains her approach to analysing body language, emphasizing the importance of understanding its impact on health and transformation. Jane inquires further about the health aspect, prompting Louise to discuss the mind-body-voice connection and how physical tension affects vocal performance. Louise emphasizes the significance of addressing bodily tension for optimal communication and health.
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Louise delves deeper into the health implications of body language, emphasizing the mind-body-voice connection and the adverse effects of physical tension on vocal performance and overall well-being. She highlights common physical manifestations of tension, such as jaw clenching and shallow breathing, and their impact on communication. Louise underscores the importance of aligning the body to facilitate effective communication and maintain good health.
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Louise discusses common vocal tension issues, such as breath control and speaking pace, and their impact on credibility and trust. She emphasizes the need to address these issues for effective communication and personal confidence. Jane and Louise explore how vocal tension affects women in particular, especially in professional settings. Louise stresses the importance of aligning the body for optimal vocal performance and credibility.
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The conversation continues on the impact of vocal tension on credibility, trust, and personal confidence. Louise highlights the significance of addressing vocal issues to maintain professional standards and confidence. They discuss Louise's model of excellence in vocal performance, emphasizing the journey towards mastery and consistent high performance. Louise underscores the importance of mastering vocal techniques for effective communication and influence.
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Louise discusses the importance of performance techniques in public speaking and client interactions, emphasizing the need for control and preparation. She highlights the significance of having a structured framework to guide engagements, enabling practitioners to focus on delivering their skills effectively. Louise reflects on the challenges she faced in growing her practice, particularly in a field with limited research and understanding. She emphasizes the importance of building trust and relationships with clients to secure work, citing her experience in overcoming hurdles, including the impact of COVID-19 on speaking engagements.
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Louise elaborates on her experience analysing media personalities and their communication styles, emphasizing the complexity of human behaviour and the challenges of simplifying analysis for mass consumption. She shares anecdotes from her interactions with media personalities, highlighting her ability to anticipate their reactions and maintain professionalism. Jane acknowledges Louise's expertise in maintaining relationships and navigating professional challenges, prompting Louise to emphasize the importance of persistence and active engagement in building a successful practice.
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In the final segment, Jane and Louise discuss Louise's retreats and coaching programs as avenues for personal and professional development. Louise outlines the structure and objectives of her retreats, emphasizing their intensive and confrontational nature aimed at fostering growth and confidence. She highlights the diverse activities and supportive environment of the retreats, aiming to provide participants with practical skills and meaningful connections. Jane concludes by inviting listeners to explore Louise's website for further information on her programs and services.
Full Show Transcript:
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Hi there, my name is Jane Anderson and this is the Jane Anderson Brand New Show. It's the podcast for experts who want to have greater impact, influence and income for their businesses and careers. As experts, we know that people buy from people and work with people who they know, who they like and who they trust.
So I'm so glad you're here because it's that time again now to really amplify how you show up in the world. Thank you so much for joining us, Louise. It's so exciting to have you on board today.
I have been so looking forward to doing the podcast with you. Thank you for agreeing to jump on. You are an absolute phenomenon in your space in terms of the work you're doing, the books you've written, the stages you've spoken on.
We don't have, I'm thrilled that you said yes to jumping on today.
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Louise, are you happy, the first question most people have is how on earth did she get into this? Are you happy to share a little bit of your background and how you got this journey to this amazing space you're in now?
[Speaker 1] (1:27 - 2:42)
Yeah, well, you know, it was an accident. Well, it wasn't an accident or really I've always followed my heart. So follow that heart.
And to follow that heart, I guess there are two parts to my background is I started off in the business world with an economics degree in statistics. That was my thing. And then I made the obvious leap into opera singing.
So, you know, having been in opera and then coming out of opera, I wanted to get back into business. And I thought I'd take over the world. And I was on a management team.
And these really wonderful people I met were doing fabulous work. And then they were asked to get up in front of the group and speak to the group. And these wonderful people I'd see get up in front of the group and I'd go, what happened to them?
You know, they were pathetic. And I just became driven. You know, what do you know about, you know, how to bring yourself forward and perform?
Which, of course, I brought from my opera background. And I just became driven and passionate about it. So it wasn't a career.
It wasn't a path I followed. It was following my heart. And I call it a calling rather than a profession, because if I didn't get paid, I'd go out on the street and do the same thing for free.
[Speaker 2] (2:43 - 3:40)
Wow. And I love that, Louise, because, you know, we often think about when we're going into this space of consulting, a big part of it is, well, what is it that fulfills me? What would I do that, you know, even if I wasn't necessarily being paid, that I love so much and love to be able to contribute?
I know I've seen a lot of the interviews that you've talked about. And often when we've spoken, you often do say, I just love what I do. I love it.
And the results, the results. So that's what I wanted to ask you about. So when you're working, are you happy to share like you spend for those who would go a little bit behind the scenes in your practice, if that's OK.
So you speak at a lot of conferences. So we've got the inspirational keynote and then you do this amazing analysis. You're in the media.
Are you happy to share a little bit about the types of modes of delivery, how you deliver speaking and coaching and training?
[Speaker 1] (3:41 - 5:37)
And so, you know, speaking, I just love speaking. I'm a show-off, born a show-off. And speaking, my passion, and speaking I call motivational.
And I was saying to you earlier, you know, I just got some feedback today and the fellow said it was a five day conference. He said, Louise, your work got us all energised. And we were we kept talking about it until the Friday afternoon.
We were still motivated and excited, excited. You know, the speaking for me is motivation. Then we come to training or what you call mini events.
I love that term, mini events, because I don't do training, mini events. And at mini events, you know, you put yourself in a whole different bracket, if you say training, but mini events where I help people learn the skills and then coaching where we get to work for longer and we embed the skills. So there are levels.
And then, of course, I run retreats so people can come over and get an immersion in the whole thing. And I've just finished one of those on Friday. And, you know, loved every minute.
So that's what I do. And with that work, people sometimes because I'm known for body language that is what I do. So let's put that up here.
And then people see me on TV. So they say, well, analysing people is what you do. Actually, the work goes from analysis.
And then we look at it from a body language perspective. But what I'm really passionate about is an analysis which we come in a different direction and look at it from a health perspective. And it's relevant.
What is the body language, which is perception of others? But the health perception is what is this doing to you as a person? And then, of course, we have to move on and learn the skills and transform.
So there's analysis, body language, health and transformation.
[Speaker 2] (5:39 - 5:56)
That's interesting, Louise, can you explain a little bit more about the health side of it? When you say what is this doing to you? Are you talking about, you know, like physiologically what it's doing to you when people are trying to transform how they communicate?
[Speaker 1] (5:56 - 7:50)
The basis of my work is the mind body voice connection. So everything starts in the mind. Yes, it does.
But, you know, being a see, I know about getting people to change and and, you know, really change in the moment. And I know that if you go back to the mind, it's too slow. It's too slow.
I get people coming in with performance anxiety who have a presentation in a few days. I don't have time to ask them about their relationship with their parents. You know what I mean?
And so forget the mind. So we go to the middleman, which is the body. And we look at how we block ourselves in the body.
Now, the voice is an outcome of those blockages so we can hear the blockages in the voice. So say, for instance, if somebody has their jaw tension and they're doing this, you can hear clearly that they have a tension in the jaw. Now, from a perception, say, you know, this looks angry or tight or aggressive.
So don't do it. Well, people usually won't change because of perception. They go, I don't care what other people think.
That's what I do. Or what if I told you jamming your tempo mandibular is killing you and will grind all your teeth down? Your tongue will become lazy.
It will age you faster. You will sound ridiculous. You know, it's and, you know, and it usually pulls the neck off and then the head goes.
Yes. And then you hurt the spine and then you can't breathe. And no, never good not to breathe.
So there are a lot of why we should constantly be looking at. Oh, freeing the way it comes out of our body and how our sound is a repercussion of that process. Forget how it's your own health.
[Speaker 2] (7:52 - 8:42)
And so it really is. If I think about, you know, some of the struggles I've had, you know, even in my own voice and things like that, like even coming off stage, you know, I notice sometimes there's tension, you know, like it's through the back of your neck or I often get a pain up the back of my head, like I'm like a sharp pain. Or it might be not being able to, like you say, often have things like my mouth will go dry.
You know, and I'm sure these are things that you find often people sometimes struggle with, particularly experts like we're experts in our space. And we're speaking on these stages. What do you find are the ones that often hold women back when they're presenting as part of building their practices and on stages?
Do you find there are particular things that are impacting on their health on stage?
[Speaker 1] (8:42 - 10:19)
Absolutely. So one of the things was I talk about two people who are just on the retreat. One, it creates sound.
So this is how you're supposed to make sound. The stomach goes in, which squeezes the air out of the lungs. The air comes out of your body.
This has nothing to do with it. It goes like this. Ha ha ha.
Can you see any movement here? No, because there isn't any. This is what many people appreciate sound.
They throw their head. They go ha ha ha. So why would you say that?
Why do you think that that's important? You know, I don't think that's it. So they throw their head.
They throw their jaw. They open their mouth. That's one of the things.
The other thing is that sometimes when we go to speak, we'll breathe high. So we'll go, look, Jane, I think one of the key things there is look, and we set our body high. We set it high.
Now, you can already the repercussion that that's having that kind of tension on your throat will give give you a new sound. And then often because I have no ear, I speak really quickly. I speak really quickly.
So people will say, if you speak really quickly, the solution is to speak more slowly. I actually can't speak more slowly. I can't.
I can't breathe. So it's all about getting your body lined up, getting the air down. How are we learning how to initiate sound?
Recognize your strategy for initiating sound. Nothing could be more important.
[Speaker 2] (10:21 - 10:56)
Wow. And Louise, what do you think the impact of that is? I mean, you're in your own practice.
You see this for yourself and you're the master of it. For those women, I know you see a lot of women who are who do have their own consulting businesses and things like that. Where do you see that that shows up?
Is it in credibility? Is it in trust? Is it in when they're trying to perhaps close a deal or something like that?
It's undermining their message and what they're saying. Is it a distraction? What's the impact of all that happening?
[Speaker 1] (10:57 - 11:52)
Credibility. Absolutely. It's all about trust is essential.
You will lose trust if you're holding your breath. You will lose trust. People don't trust people who break the sound like that.
And you can't have influence because you can't get through all of that trust and credibility to have influence. But the biggest thing that I find is that people will get away with a lot of mistakes. But then they come and they say to me, I have lost my confidence.
So it's not about how you come across. It's about the personal impact that these failings have on us. We just say, I feel I don't have gravitas.
I just don't have the confidence. And and I've lost my confidence. Look, if I had a penny for every time I've heard that, I'd be rich.
[Speaker 2] (11:53 - 12:22)
Right. And you talk about this. You've got an amazing white paper called Applied Confidence, where you talk about I love this model that you have.
You talk about these levels of you have got this visual representation of how the voice works. Yes. So I over time and the the it's not just volume, but the quality of the voice and how it evolves into excellence.
Are you happy to share a bit about that? I find it fascinating voice.
[Speaker 1] (12:22 - 13:25)
Yeah. So this is the Y axis, which is your, you know, excellence in performance. And this is the X axis, which is over time.
You know, you start off and you have an engagement, you're going along and you might be quite good and not so good, not so good. And keep going. We're going that way.
The thing is that there is a line here somewhere that is the line of excellence when you hit a professional level and people start off, which is and we stay sometimes better, sometimes not. But we never hit that sort of professional standard. We want to get up so that we know what that feels like.
And you'll drop up and down, drop up and down and then get so that we drop down less than we're above. And then eventually you're completely above. So you're having an off day, but you still come in and above that professional line and continue through the day above that professional line.
And, you know, that's the mastery, isn't it? Never to slip down.
[Speaker 2] (13:25 - 13:51)
Oh, and so this is the work that you do. Yeah, you're working on not just being able to progress through those levels, but to actually get to a point of mastery, like you say, that regardless of what your day is like, whatever's happened, it doesn't matter. You can you know how to tap into that level of excellence in terms of how you communicate, influence, use your voice, all that.
Yeah.
[Speaker 1] (13:51 - 14:57)
You have to be able to perform under water. It has to be under control. And people say, oh, but how can I think of this and do my work?
Well, you don't, because if you're thinking about it while you're presenting or talking to a client, it's too late. You know, the work happens before that. It's when you get out and the rubber hits the road in that performance.
But you only ever say these are all known performance thoughts. You only ever say five percent of your mind for your technique, five percent maximum, and one of the things that I talk about a lot these days is the frameworks that you're using to structure your engagement. And people don't think about their framework.
And they'll say to me, they have to do tons of preparation. You don't have time in today's world to do preparation. You don't have time.
You have to have a framework that you're going to follow. And then the skills that just come out because you practice them enough.
[Speaker 2] (14:59 - 15:51)
Amazing. So if I can go then to your practice, Louise, because we've come from this is coming from your expertise, which is truly extraordinary. And if anything, really quite groundbreaking because there's not really a lot of research in this space, your doctor, Louise Mahler, and a lot of your work is sort of identified that there isn't a lot of research in this space.
And you're having to articulate this with the audiences you're working with. When you came into your practice and as it started, what have been some of the biggest challenges that you faced in growing your practice? I'm guessing COVID is probably one of them with being a professional speaker and how many gigs sort of went from the calendar pretty quickly.
What have been some of the biggest challenges for you growing your practice? Yeah.
[Speaker 1] (15:52 - 17:58)
Yeah, you're right, Jane. In my PhD, I won outstanding recommendations from the examiners internationally and the University for my PhD for innovation ideas. And a lot of my literature research was not about a literature review, but a lack of literature review and the rubbish that is spoken.
There are 32 fields of voice, for instance, all that address voice for different people. None, basically, that address voice adequately for people in business. So, for instance, an ongologist will say, oh, you want to talk about voice.
Does Jane have cancer of the throat? No. Oh, well, then I'm afraid I can't help.
You know, the speech pathologist. Does Jane have a lisp or maybe a paralysed vocal fold? No.
Oh, well, I can't help. You know, singers don't want to work with people who speak. Actors want to do their own style of imitation.
There's few people who can help you in the every day, every man getting out, every woman getting out and speaking in a professional environment. It's dealt with in nonverbal skills, which is then only dealt with from the area of perception, not reality. So the lack of understanding of the work, the depth of the work has been left out of our culture for 70 years now.
70 years. So that's been a huge challenge. So all of my work comes from people who know me.
So it's very hard to sell work. In fact, a client I'm debriefing with this morning from the conference last week, he said, you've no idea how difficult it was to get you in, you know, to get you in to do so. He said, thank you, because, you know, you were amazing.
But he said also you lifted my credibility and people don't get the work until they see it. And so I get all my work from past work.
[Speaker 2] (18:00 - 19:23)
That's interesting, because a lot of women that we work with who are in the community will often say things like they're trying to sort of get in and change something, but they feel like, oh, I feel like I'm trying to sell them what they need as opposed to what they want. And what you're saying is that a big part of that is the relationships and the trust that you've built with the clients, because everyone sort of books you who knows you. Yeah, it's only one way to get in and do it, get in and do it.
Oh, get in and do it. OK, sorry, go ahead. Yeah, because they don't know what they want.
Yeah, OK. And you know what they want. So what that looks like in your practice, Louise, if I think about the media, you do an incredible amount of work in the media.
And you're applying your skill into some of the ways they can consume that in a way they understand how to consume it. So if I see you on TV, for example, if I see you on Sunrise or I see you on Today is that you'll do, say, the analysis and we'll go, oh, that's great. You know, that's so entertaining.
It's funny. She's insightful. All those things.
I'm not necessarily there for the transformation. I'm there for the entertainment. But if I want to embed that, if I want to learn more about that and that's the transformation, then you've got a mode there to be able to work with them.
[Speaker 1] (19:24 - 20:19)
I find doing media is very fascinating because you're dealing. They want you to bring us down to the lowest common denominator. The lowest common denominator always talks about truth and lies.
And they always want to ask, is this person telling the truth rather than telling a lie? Well, you know, so for instance, with Amber Heard, I got 2.7 million hits on my Amber Heard analysis. I know people saying, is she telling the truth or a lie?
Well, how about she's telling her truth? Because I actually believe she has a bit of a personality disorder, which means she has set a story with characters and what happens. And that's the way it is.
And nothing deviates from that. So she's telling that story as she sees it. And it's a bit distorted.
But she's not lying. She's not lying. She's telling her truth.
Well, that's a kind of a middle ground. You know, it's a bit more complicated.
[Speaker 2] (20:20 - 20:34)
Yes. It's fascinating to watch your analysis. If you're listening to the podcast, I will put links to that actual video that you're talking about.
That was phenomenal. 2.7 million views, which is outstanding.
[Speaker 1] (20:34 - 20:40)
And it got all the way to one else in the world. So it obviously is something that hit a nail for people.
[Speaker 2] (20:41 - 21:38)
Yes, because we sometimes find it hard, don't we, to articulate. There's a reason why that person doesn't really do it for me. Or there's something that's not quite right.
And not just for yourself, but for us as experts is we need to be able to articulate those intuition or that intuition or those feelings that people are having. You're translating it through your expertise to go, well, this is how often I know how often I've watched you and I see on the media and what she's saying, I go, oh, she's nailed that. That's exactly right.
And I remember when you did this video on your website, which is with Dave Hughes and which is hilarious. And you talk about some of the characters that are on that on that show and you talked about Murph Hughes and you said, look at Murph, he's so likable, he's so trustworthy. And you're like, he is actually.
[Speaker 1] (21:39 - 23:18)
And he is. They're always trying to catch me out. But it's a bit like throwing me into the pickle patch, you know, because I analyze my life and I do it.
And when I did that Dave Hughes one, there's these comedians, professional comedians, and they get on and they just think, oh, lamb to the slaughter, they're going to have me for breakfast. So I was one step ahead of them before. When I got out there, I had them all analyzed.
And just from watching TV in the green room, I was just watching them do it. And it was a bit like, you know, I was thinking Harper Valley PTA. There's Mr. Jones is sitting there and seven times he's asked me for a day. You know, I like I had them all lined up. Don't you get me? I'm going to get you first.
And this breakfast TV, they throw me in. And I had Sam the other day who I never met before. And then he turns to me, you know, unscripted.
And he says, yeah, what do you see in me? And, you know, you're on national live TV. You've got to, you know, and funnily enough, I've been watching him and I went, well, you do this, you know, and and, you know, but they're always trying to catch me out.
You know, they they want you to trip up. They always want to simplify it. So this Wednesday I got a TV and they want to know why.
What is it that we people do that we don't like when we meet them? And what can you do if you do like, well, I could go on for hours and go into a big gray area there. But instead, it's like in business, you've got to bring it down to here are five things that you could do.
And I think, ah, you know, that's how you get the airtime.
[Speaker 2] (23:19 - 24:02)
That's right. And Louise, in terms of in terms of building your practice or with the you see a lot of female consultants, you're at conferences and see a lot of them on stages and the things that they're doing with growing their businesses.
-
What advice would you have for someone who's perhaps listening today and listening to this interview with you?
You have you are probably one of the most experienced female consultants or women working with the corporate sector in the country. What advice would you have for them if they're looking at you and going, how on earth has Louise done this? How can I tap into some of her expertise?
What could I be doing better? What do you find when you're working with them? What advice would you have?
[Speaker 1] (24:02 - 24:38)
Jane, I've worked hard. You have? Yeah, I've worked hard.
And, you know, I've always said to get work, walk out the front door and turn left. And, you know, I do. That means pick up the phone.
Who is it? I haven't spoken to for two years. Hi.
And what's a reason I could think of? You know, Storm, did they? I read something on LinkedIn about them.
I don't know. But just keep contact. Keep going.
Keep out there. Get up and do, do, do, do, do. I don't have any smart marketing strategies.
I just work.
[Speaker 2] (24:38 - 24:44)
Yeah, you definitely do. And you're the master of maintaining those relationships. Sorry.
Go ahead.
[Speaker 1] (24:44 - 24:46)
Well, I try, but yeah, I try.
[Speaker 2] (24:47 - 25:19)
Yeah, it is. But you make it look so easy. And I think it does look easy.
Like, oh, how hard can it be? She's on TV and look, she's on a stage. Is this what you do?
Louise, it's been such a pleasure and we've been so fortunate to have you on the show, if people are interested in working with you or interested in learning more about your programs. I think a big one is probably your retreats and you have some coaching programs. Are you happy to share a little bit about your retreats and how they work, perhaps?
[Speaker 1] (25:20 - 26:22)
Yeah, the retreats are three days and I hold them in different places, maybe even one in Europe next year, three days. And we come along. And the idea is to analyze everything that you do in terms of everything with your body, your voice and your structure and then say, well, is this working for other people?
But is it working for you? Are you you lost your confidence? And then we start on the new skills and we work them through.
And the key to the work that I do is it's quite confrontational. So we make it funny. Right.
Yeah, very vulnerable thing to go through. Yeah, we have a lot of laps and small group, small group. And, you know, we work all day, every day.
And then we go to dinner and a walk. And we actually have a horse psychology session and you can have a mask if you want one. And we have a yoga person coming in the morning.
You know, it's just go, go, go, go, go. And lots of fun, fun, fun, fun, fun. And make the best friends you've ever had before.
[Speaker 2] (26:23 - 27:15)
Oh, wow. I love that. I think Seth Godin talks about retreats and he says you always want to walk out with a better to do list and a better group of friends.
I think he's right. So for those who are listening today, if you're thinking about you want to find out more about Louise, jump on Louise's website, Louise, Louise is Dr. Louise Mala, sorry, Louise Mala dot com dot you jump on the website. Louise's retreats are on there.
You have those retreats, but you can attend as an individual. But organisations could also work with you and you can do those internally. And Louise has some coaching as well.
She has a fantastic book called Resonate, which is also available on the website to Louise. It's been such a pleasure to have you on the show today. Thank you so much for your time.
I know how busy you are and we look forward to perhaps seeing you back on the show again in future. Thank you.
